electrical scare

Frank Fusco

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Location
Mountain Home, Arkansas
Those who have been here a while know that I am nearly a complete zero when it comes to things electrik. I don't do much with electriks and don't like to. But, as a homeowner, certain things are necessary for maintenance. Yesterday, I had to change switches for the light in my office. It is a three-way set-up. Only two switches, that's 'two way', why do they call it "three way"? Nebber mind, I don't really want to know. ;) Ennyhow, I went to the electriks supply store and bought two new switches. First big surprise. I had my credit card ready to pay. Didn't need it. Price was $2.00 for two switches. ONE DOLLAR EACH! I didn't know you could buy anything for only a dollar anymore. Paid the man with real money. If he had said ten bucks each, I wouldn't have known if that was right or wrong. See where I'm headed? :eek:
Back home, smart enough to kill the power to the switch. It is right off my shop where the breaker box is. Flipped the switch, lights went off. Started working. Changed one switch, putting the various colored wires right back on the new one where the old ones came off. Not bad. Haven't even fried myself yet. Yet. Went to other box. Uh-Oh! Sumptins different. These wires on old switch go in little holes instead of being wrapped around a screw. But won't come out. Pulled hard, stayed stuck. So, got cutter and cut then stripped. Noticed new switch had little holes too, so stuck a couple wires in there. Then the fireworks started. Got a big spark and zap. :eek: Backed away. Gathered my nerves. Changed pants. Went to breaker box and shut off the main for whole house. Went back and tried to connect the ground. Yep, I know which that is even if I don't understand the principal of it. More 'fun'. :eek: Came completely out of wall and I now have the ground wire in my hand. Looked in box and tried to make sure no nekkid wires were touching anything. Turned house back on. No smoke or sparks. Called electrician. Got voice mail. Call never returned. Called another. He is busy but 'might' call me this afternoon. So, I'm typing in the dark. But, I'm not fried. Keep me away from electriks. :eek:
 
3 ways confuse me every time. When wiring the house I could do them no problem. Then I don't do them for a whileand I forget how to wire them and have to sketch it out to get it in my head again.

I am betting that your new switch and your old switch are not identical. You have a wire in the wrong place. Get some candles, a flashlight, whatever and just wait. ;)
 
3 ways confuse me every time. When wiring the house I could do them no problem. Then I don't do them for a whileand I forget how to wire them and have to sketch it out to get it in my head again.

I am betting that your new switch and your old switch are not identical. You have a wire in the wrong place. Get some candles, a flashlight, whatever and just wait. ;)

You forget. I do the candle thing often. No elektriks at rendezvous. :rolleyes:
 
There should have been another hole next to the one with the wire in it. If you push a pin or small screwdriver in it, the wire will come out. Electricity can be exciting, especially when you drill a rathole for the bathroom heater wiring and hit the 220 for the central air.:eek: Been there, done that, still have the drill bit.
 
Chuck, that's my thought too, but why the sparks when the power to that circuit was off? That's the real question. Surely it's not on two circuits!?!?!? I don't guess it would keep it from working, but if that's what happened, someone flubbed up!
Let us know how it turns out, Frank. Jim.
 
If you got sparks when the breaker was off... then it seems to me you have two circuits in that box.

That's why it's good to have a tester with you when you open up boxes like that. It's a simple little neon lamp on two leads, like this:
Neon_Test_Lamp.jpg
Not expensive at all. touch one end to the hot, and the other to ground and see if there's light or not. I usually do that for all the hots in the box, especially if there is even the slightest question of their being more than one circuit.

Here, I googled and found a quick/simple guide that illustrates the most common ways to wire up a three way switch.

best,
...art
 
I have to admit I often work on circuits hot (without turning off the circuit breaker) - but maybe that's not a good idea for you:)

One piece of advice. Before you touch or grab any wire (even if you think the power's off), brush it with the back of your fingers. If it's hot, you'll feel a tickle but your fingers will close and come away from the wire. It's not dangerous if you're wearing rubber sole shoes and not standing in water - and don't have your other hand on a pipe or other ground. Put your other hand in your pocket to be sure.

Of course, a meter or some other indicator (like the one Art posted) will also work, but you don't always have one right at hand.

Mike
 
Mike,

I've worked on everything from wiring my shop to radar and communications equipment in air traffic control centers to MR scanners, CT scanners and x-ray equipment. Only when there is no other way to trouble shoot or align something will I work on it live. I have only been shocked a couple of times since 1969. Sometimes you have to work on stuff live. I wouldn't make it a SOP though.
 
Mike,

I've worked on everything from wiring my shop to radar and communications equipment in air traffic control centers to MR scanners, CT scanners and x-ray equipment. Only when there is no other way to trouble shoot or align something will I work on it live. I have only been shocked a couple of times since 1969. Sometimes you have to work on stuff live. I wouldn't make it a SOP though.
Yep, I know it's bad practice. Sometimes I'm just too lazy to walk to the breaker box to turn off the circuit. But even when I turn the power off, I brush the wire before I grab it.

Mike

[Let me point out that I'm talking about residential circuits, not commercial circuits which may be at quite a higher voltage.]
 
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There should have been another hole next to the one with the wire in it. If you push a pin or small screwdriver in it, the wire will come out. Electricity can be exciting, especially when you drill a rathole for the bathroom heater wiring and hit the 220 for the central air.:eek: Been there, done that, still have the drill bit.

Dale, I thought you were my friend. :( Now you want me to go poking screwdrivers and pins into holes of things that are going 'spark' and 'zap' when it's not supposed to.....? :eek: Not this elektrikal fraidy cat. ;)
 
If you got sparks when the breaker was off... then it seems to me you have two circuits in that box.

That's why it's good to have a tester with you when you open up boxes like that. It's a simple little neon lamp on two leads, like this:
View attachment 21975
Not expensive at all. touch one end to the hot, and the other to ground and see if there's light or not. I usually do that for all the hots in the box, especially if there is even the slightest question of their being more than one circuit.

Here, I googled and found a quick/simple guide that illustrates the most common ways to wire up a three way switch.

best,
...art


I have one of those testers and a voltage meter. But, if I knew what I was doing, the switch would have been changed without incident or this discussion. :eek: Yep, it dawned on me there are two circuits in that box. Turning off the one breaker wasn't sufficient. I'm grateful that the circuit breaker worked as it should. I'll get a pro here Monday to finish the job. Those $1.00 switches are turning out more expensive than planned. But, still, much cheaper than if I continue messing around.
 
Most excitement I ever had with electricity was at my old job. When I went to plug in a TIG welder, the 440 outlet that came down from the buss bar made a bright flash and bang. Called out an electrician to fix the outlet. When he saw the TIG welder he said I had blown one of the lines for the 3 phase and he would have to figure out which one. I honest to God didn't do it on purpose, I was just changing air tools. When he stuck the probes for the meter in the outlet I popped the quick connect on a 1" air line. The bang from that at the same time he put the probe in the outlet made for some girlish screams and jumping around. Wouldn't have thought a guy that works with electricity for a living would be so skittish.
 
The store I owned in Indiana was formerly a supermarket. Front was my store, back was receiving and storing of merchandise. The back had a painted concrete floor. One day, I put one of my employees to work wet mopping the floor. Suddenly, there was a very loud explosion sound. I ran to the back, expecting to find the worst. Instead, just one, very scared, employee. While mopping, she had run the wet mop over a spot that had been the electrical connection for where coolers or freezer had set previously. When they were removed the lines were just cut flush with the floor and left to be. Those lines also serviced other parts of the store so were, naturally, left hot. Scary. Paid an electrician to re-do things same day. Owner of the building was an 80 year old woman so I didn't send Rocco visiting. ;) I don't like elektriks.
 
Well, folks, I'm learning more and more, I should never mess with elektriks. After all that fuss with the switches and paying close to $100.00 for a professional to finish the job, I learned yesterday the switches were just fine to start with. My fluorescent shop light that I use in my 'office' :rofl: is still going out. It will operate about a half hour then go out. I'll wait about 15 min. then it will turn on again. I'm sure the unit is bad. Just installed new tubes but I'm going to trash the whole thing and install something else. Speaking of trash, I'm not knocking Wal-Mart, they are what they are and I shop there a lot. But, this is the fourth fluorescent shop fixture I have had in here (I upgrade with each replacement) and all have gone bad after several months of use. I'm through with WM lights. :mad: Off to Lowe's after the trip.
 
It's the ballast. That's where they save money is by putting cheap ballasts in the fixtures. The rest of it is OK. I buy the cheap fixtures and just plan on putting good ballasts in down the road. Ballasts are usually as much as the fixture is, but it solves he problem for a long time.

In your case, it's probably cheaper to keep replacing them. ;)
 
Oh Man!!

Hey guys! I couldnt help thinking you did not buy 3 way switches to replace your old ones too. I do have some good advise though when it comes to doing electrical work. Always look up the ladder before you go up it. I didnt one day and I rammed my head into a steel support bar for the garage door rails. I ended up having a neck fusion over it. First rule: Always look up before climbing. :eek: Second rule: see first rule.:thumb:
 
Hey guys! I couldnt help thinking you did not buy 3 way switches to replace your old ones too. I do have some good advise though when it comes to doing electrical work. Always look up the ladder before you go up it. I didnt one day and I rammed my head into a steel support bar for the garage door rails. I ended up having a neck fusion over it. First rule: Always look up before climbing. :eek: Second rule: see first rule.:thumb:

Don, you are new here. Older members know about me, ladders and elektriks. Yes, I would follow your rule. I would look up. Walk away and call a professional. Expensive, but I am enjoying life. Had a good friend die two weeks ago from a ladder accident. $50.00 an hour pro is cheap by comparison.
 
Ladders!!

Yeah Frank, I recently heard of another great guy that bought a new double wide on the lake with a big 30x30 shop attached and the week before he was to move in with his wife he fell off ladder putting the last piece of gutter on. Sad story. He crushed ribs in his chest and had heart attack in helicoptor on way to hospital. If he would of paid for it to be done his wife wouldnt be alone in that new house now. Terrible!
 
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