Menu
What's new

Table saw to dryer outlet troubles/Please help!!

Craig Johnson

Craig Johnson

Member
Messages
113
Location
The Couv, Washington
Hi everyone.
I have my new Steel City table saw that I got about a week ago.
I have been getting the pieces I need to adapt it to use my dryer outlet (2 tapered slanted slots and one L shaped) so I can power it up with the proper voltage.
I bought some 10/3 Romex and a 6 foot dryer cord at Lowes.
I spent most of today cutting/splicing wires and making my own extension cord. I double checked everything and plugged it in. Flipped the switch and.......nothing. Does not turn the saw on.
I have been doing some more research and it looks as if the center lug is not a ground but a neutral. I am not sure if this has something to do with this or not. Our house was build in 95.
I do not have the funds to have an electrician come out and give me info or wire a proper 220 outlet.
So at this point I thought I had it right but have no power to the saw. I will also add I do not have a multimeter to see if voltage is at switch.
I thought for sure I had it right but could there be something I am overlooking?
I am trying to educate myself as best I can and want to make sure this extension cord is done correctly and will work properly.
Geez at this point I might even be willing to pay someone to build one of these and send it to me.
Please anyone who has this same scenario please let me know if you can help.

Thanks,
Craig
 
A lightbulb in a socket with a couple wires will work as a multimeter for this job, but I suggest that you invest the couple dollars for the junk multimeters available today.

The bent leg in the middle of the dryer plug, which normally is the center wire of the three, and is the safety ground, and goes to the frame of the 240 volt saw, or a green terminal.

There is no neutral in the 240 volt circuit. Although not technically correct, think of it as +120 and -120, so if you measure from one to the other, the difference is the 240 volts you are looking for.

If you use the lightbulb trick, it should light normally connected from each "leg" to the safety ground, and if you briefly connect the lightbulb between the legs it will be very bright (if you just do it for an instant, the bulb will probably survive the 240 volts).

If you don't have that light combo, and the dryer works normally, the problem is in your cord.
 
Charlie, as usual covered it well, but what this thread really needs, so we can help you more is a couple of pictures, take some pics of all the various parts, and tell us what is what, and we will get that saw working for you in no time :thumb:
 
Ok. Heres the pics. Hopefully this is sufficient to get her up and runnin.

switch. white and black positive. green grounded to back of plate.
IMG_1962.jpg


switch/110v cable assy
IMG_1963.jpg


dryer cord
IMG_1964.jpg

IMG_1965.jpg


saw literature on voltage change
IMG_1966.jpg


dryer cord info
IMG_1967.jpg


IMG_1968.jpg


10/3 romex cable
IMG_1969.jpg

IMG_1970.jpg


On the Romex cable I used only 3 of the 4 wires. 2 for hot and the bare one for ground.

Hopefully this will help decipher things. Thanks guys.
 
Craig Johnson said:
On the Romex cable I used only 3 of the 4 wires. 2 for hot and the bare one for ground.
Click to expand...

Charlie, Stu,

Could this be a hint at the problem? Maybe there's no connected return?

Craig, I know very little about electricity, but I did manage to run a subpanel to my shop, and if I can do it, so can you. Often I have to stare at it for a long time, and then suddenly I'll see my mistake. It's not complicated, you just have to get it exactly right! ;) I mean, there're only like 4 or 5 variables in the equation, right?

Sometimes it works if I talk myself through it, as in "Ok, this one goes here, and this one goes there..." Feels silly, but it works.

Oh, and do you have a good book? That helps a lot! ;)

Thanks,

Bill


PS. if you can't tell, you shouldn't take electrical advice from a doofus like me! Listen to Charlie and Stu!
 
I do know this is probably something really simple. As you say there cant be that many variables that can keep it from not working.
And I do talk myself through it.
The only thing I think I should recheck besides the extension cord issue is the voltage conversion at the motor. That is straightforward as well but just to double check.
 
Craig,

You make no mention of changing the wiring on the motor junction box from 110 to 230 volt operation. On the dual voltage capable table saws, the motor is generally pre-wired for 110. Remove the junction box (located on the motor) cover and first verify that the motor is indeed dual voltage and then rewire for 230 per the diagram that should be on the cover. Your manual should have instructions for all of this.
 
Bill Satko said:
Craig,

You make no mention of changing the wiring on the motor junction box from 110 to 230 volt operation. On the dual voltage capable table saws, the motor is generally pre-wired for 110. Remove the junction box (located on the motor) cover and first verify that the motor is indeed dual voltage and then rewire for 230 per the diagram that should be on the cover. Your manual should have instructions for all of this.
Click to expand...

I did that too but forgot to mention it.....
 
First, when it comes to electrical, you are always, and I mean ALWAYS better off double, or triple checking stuff before you plug stuff in. My whole family are electrician, both grandfathers, my father (he was also an electrical inspector for the province for 30 years) numerous uncles, my older brother, and numerous cousins, even so, I've seen them wire something wrong, and let the factory packed smoke out, it happens, so asking dumb questions, when it comes to electrical make perfect sense. :thumb: Besides, there are no dumb questions, only dumb mistakes (usually occurring after the dumb question was NOT asked.........DAMHIKT :doh:)

Check the motor wiring, that was my first question, it is very easy to get one wire wrong on a motor an it will NOT spin.

Now looking at your "Romex" cable, I'm confused :huh:

As I understand things you have a dryer plug in your workshop area, and you are just plugging your TS into said plug? I guess that is incorrect :huh:

OK, are you wiring in a new plug that starts at your dryer plug and goes to your work area?

If that is the case, then I understand the Romex cable.

Your existing dryer receptacle is a 3 wire set up? I guess you are in an older home then, as the new setup requires a 4-prong receptacle, they don't allow the neutral to be the ground anymore.

OK, what Charlie said earlier, is still spot on.

On your dryer cord you have three wires

right, left, and center.

Right one to the black wire

Left one to the white wire

Center one to the green wire

Make sure you use the correct crimp on connectors, and a bit of shrink wrap over the crimped part is a nice safety feature, but not mandatory.

On your old dryer receptacle you should have three wires as well, just like the cord.

I found these on the web........

breakerbox.gif dryerplugwiring.gif
I hope that explains a bit more about what is happening here, with the three wires compared to 4 wires.

ARRRGH

I've been interrupted about 6 times while trying to write this, :doh:sorry, but I've not got to run, so don't take anything I've written here as gospel :bang:

What you can take to the bank is what Charlie wrote, he is exactly right on his wiring explanation.

I'd check that motor wiring, could be the problem.

Sorry, got to run :eek:
 
Stuart Ablett said:
First, when it comes to electrical, you are always, and I mean ALWAYS better off double, or triple checking stuff before you plug stuff in. My whole family are electrician, both grandfathers, my father (he was also an electrical inspector for the province for 30 years) numerous uncles, my older brother, and numerous cousins, even so, I've seen them wire something wrong, and let the factory packed smoke out, it happens, so asking dumb questions, when it comes to electrical make perfect sense. :thumb: Besides, there are no dumb questions, only dumb mistakes (usually occurring after the dumb question was NOT asked.........DAMHIKT :doh:)

Check the motor wiring, that was my first question, it is very easy to get one wire wrong on a motor an it will NOT spin.
I just did that...ok per the instructions on the cover on the motor.

Now looking at your "Romex" cable, I'm confused :huh:

As I understand things you have a dryer plug in your workshop area, and you are just plugging your TS into said plug? I guess that is incorrect :huh:
The outlet is for the dryer. I will be unplugging the dryer to use the saw.

OK, are you wiring in a new plug that starts at your dryer plug and goes to your work area?
I simply want to use the dryer outlet for the saw. Hence the new 3 prong dryer cord to plug into dryer outlet.

If that is the case, then I understand the Romex cable.

Your existing dryer receptacle is a 3 wire set up? I guess you are in an older home then, as the new setup requires a 4-prong receptacle, they don't allow the neutral to be the ground anymore.
Yes our house was built in 95.

OK, what Charlie said earlier, is still spot on.

On your dryer cord you have three wires

right, left, and center.

Right one to the black wire

Left one to the white wire

Center one to the green wire

Make sure you use the correct crimp on connectors, and a bit of shrink wrap over the crimped part is a nice safety feature, but not mandatory.
I used yellow crimp style butt connectors with heat shrink tubing (looked nice when done).

On your old dryer receptacle you should have three wires as well, just like the cord.

I found these on the web........

View attachment 25937 View attachment 25936
I hope that explains a bit more about what is happening here, with the three wires compared to 4 wires.

ARRRGH

I've been interrupted about 6 times while trying to write this, :doh:sorry, but I've not got to run, so don't take anything I've written here as gospel :bang:

What you can take to the bank is what Charlie wrote, he is exactly right on his wiring explanation.

I'd check that motor wiring, could be the problem.

Sorry, got to run :eek:
Click to expand...

One thing I am confused on, from what I understand the center wire on the dryer outlet is NOT a ground...or is it? Should I be treating this like a ground wire?
 
Craig,

The 3rd wire is a neutral...not really ground. Is your wall socket "grounded" ( green wire connected directly to your electrical panel frame)? You can run a true ground wire, using a separate green wire from the frame of your saw to the socket frame, if it is.

Additionally...in your dryer, you would need 120V for the timer and other control circuits. That's why the "neutral" wire is there...return for the 120V. As Charlie said, you will be using the 240V that is between the 2 hot wires (-120 and +120 if you will).
 
Last edited:
Craig,

Have tired Charlie's "test" on the cord you built?

If you use the lightbulb trick, it should light normally connected from each "leg" to the safety ground, and if you briefly connect the lightbulb between the legs it will be very bright (if you just do it for an instant, the bulb will probably survive the 240 volts).
Click to expand...
Hot to center neutral = 120VAC. Try the lightbulb with one hot wire and neutral...then again with the other hot wire and neutral.
 
The center wire is not a ground, but you treat it like a ground in this case, it is grounded to the chassis of the machine, in your case, the green wire in the switch box.

5385d1196110580-dryer-wiring-3-prong-neutral-wire-dsc051802.jpg dryer-w3wirecord.jpg

Center wire to the green wire on your machine (chassis ground) the two outside wires go one to the black wire and one to the white wire.

I think :eek:
 
as far as ground and common........they both go to earth, just via different wires. so as long as you have a continous path from the green wire on your saw to the bent blade on your plug that should be fine.
check motor wiring and any safty or thermal overloads on the saw.......
did you turn the breaker back on?
 
Clarification...

The neutral wire and the safety green wire are connected together at the service entry ... where the power comes into the house. If you measure between the outer wires and the center wire you will find 120 volts. However, to keep the maximum effectiveness of the safety ground, it should not routinely be used to carry power. Will it work? Yes. Is it legal? No, because it reduces the effectiveness of the safety circuit.

When you wire your saw for 240 volts, you no longer have legitimate 120 volt power available at the saw, but you don't need it either.

BUT... why are you making this a big job? A saw that is 120/240 volts has to be able to run on 120 volts, and to get UL approval for residential use it has to run on a household circuit. To be able to do the household circuit bit, it has to be no more that 1 1/2 to (stretching it) 2 hp. So reset the motor to the way it was when it came and just plug the 120 volt plug that came with the saw into a 120 volt outlet. There are some theoretical advantages to using 240 rather than 120 in heavy use, but when I converted my table saw, I couldn't tell the difference. When I sold that saw, I converted it back to 120 volts.
 
A blunt opinion here. If you can afford a Steel City table saw, you can afford an electrician. Might be much cheaper, in both the short and long run, than burning out the motor on the saw, and/or, possibly causing a house fire. I am el cheapo supremo here. But, even I dished out about $100.00 to have a professional electrician come over and wire a switch for me when I found things were not normal.
In fact, you probably cannot afford to NOT have a professional electrician wire that thing properly for you.
 
Frank, Frank, Frank... It's no *fun* if you hire someone else to do it! ;)

Where's the excitement? Where's the thrill? Where's the, forgive me, buzz? ;)

When I was growing up in San Diego, we could walk by the MCRD. Oddly, every once in a while you could hear the DI shouting "I wanna be an airborne ranger/ I want to live a life of danger..." while everyone marched.

Weird, when you think about it, but you get the drift! ;)

Besides, weren't they just talking about self-sufficiency in another thread? ;)

Thanks,

Bill
 
Ok everyone.
I have an update.
Now have a multimeter and have correct voltage to connector that attaches to motor.
Checked again how the diagram shows for connection for 240v.

Heres how they show it on the motor plate for 120v:

black and red wires go to black for 120v
gray and yellow go to white for 120v

Heres what it shows for 240v:
black to black for 240v
yellow to white for 240v

It shows the gray and red wires not being connected to anything therefore I would assume they are taped off and not used.
Next step will be to contact Steel City if all else looks correct.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top