Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: Brown Blurrs and an Interesting Afternoon

  1. #1

    Brown Blurrs and an Interesting Afternoon

    I was in my shop casually putting up a ceiling in there. I had the door open and was watching the snow falling down when a brown blurr zipped past the door. For a second I did not know what happened, but fearing a coyote was on the bliz for a sheep I ran to look. Sure enough that brown blurr of a coyote is gone, but as I watch the snow swirling away in his hastily laid tracks I am pretty near bambooseled by the three hounds that are on his heels.

    Now this is happening between my shop and the back door of my house, a distance of 50 feet. The sheep are within spitting distance of where I am and they beat feet far away in the pasture. So I start yelling, what else is a man to do to protect his sheep in 1.2 seconds of elapsed time? So instead of stopping the coyote moves on at 800 mph, with three dogs right behind him.

    Apparently yelling was the wrong thing to do because the third dog stops his pursuit and starts hanging around the house. Now sheep farmers have two predator issues, with coyotes being the #2 problem, and the number one being domestic dogs. I am scared the dog will mess with the sheep and the sheep are just plain scared. Now my dogs get into the mix and its the stand-off between my two dogs, the strange dog and four sheep. In the distance a coyote is on the run, and two hounds close behind yelping as all get out. This is NOT good.

    Now this is Sunday so no hunting is allowed here. I can't call animal control or the police because someone will get into trouble for Sunday hunting and this is the ironic part. I fear coyotes, but I feel domestic dogs. In this case I have a a predator of sheep running down a predator of sheep. Who is right, and who is wrong. I cannot get mad at the dogs who are chasing away the biggest wild eater of lamb, yet statistically dogs are more of a problem then coyotes. Finally I get close enough to grab the dogs collar, and lacking a better place to put him, I throw him in my shop and start calling the local hunters to see who has hunting dogs missing.

    Come to find out they are just training the newer dogs and this dog was only 6 months old and running with the older dogs which explains his inattention to the pursuit. They come and got the dog awhile later and thank me up and down for keeping their dog until they got there. Without guns, they were not hunting so everything was legitimate. I thank them up and down for hunting coyotes in the area, then there is this "no, thank you for letting us hunt on your land, then after a minute of going back and forth in thank yous, we finally agree its just a good place live and all have to get along and they drive off with puppy in tow.

    As for the sheep, they aren't so sure. They stand in one spot for 3 hours just looking at me, mortified. Not laying down, not walking around, just standing there in a small circle of fleece looking...well...rather sheepish at the whole affair.

    So anything interesting happen while you were working in your shop today?
    Last edited by Travis Johnson; 12-07-2008 at 07:20 PM.
    I have no intention of traveling from birth to the grave in a manicured and well preserved body; but rather I will skid in sideways, totally beat up, completely worn out, utterly exhausted and jump off my tractor and loudly yell, "Wow, this is what it took to feed a nation!"

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Mountain Home, Arkansas
    Posts
    11,834
    Travis asked, "So anything interesting happen while you were working in your shop today?"
    Yep. I read your post.
    Snow? Keep it there.
    Hunting? Protecting yer livestock ain't hunting. I would have shot hounds and coyote given the opportunity. Old country saying: "Shoot, shovel, shut up."

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Delton, Michigan
    Posts
    17,476

    3 S's

    to those who do the 3 S's,, be sure to do the last one and no one is safe.. in our parts that was the usual but in the last few years the pet owners are gaing control... and evne if you dont know the owner and the officer hears of it your done..as long as there is proof of course.. in travis's case they were doing him a favor as he said.. neithr of the two were intent on the sheep just the coyote for gettun outa the country and the dogs for gettun the coyote.. some high dollar fines have been levied in this area for that 3 S's..
    If in Doubt, Build it Stout!
    One hand washes the other!
    Don't put off today till tomorrow!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Buse Township MN
    Posts
    565
    Great story, can't top that today.

    I do always keep some form of "lead launcher" in the shop though, in case a critter needs killing.......following all laws, of course
    Every child deserves a family. Adopt. Foster. Get involved.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Bellingham
    Posts
    2,450

    It is different out West.

    I did a quick check on Washington State law and it appears that you are able to kill a dog that is chasing your livestock. Of course you would need to check your local restrictions about discharging a firearm. I guess that is where bow hunters like Larry have a leg up in this situation.

    Mileage may vary in your own state.

    16.08.010
    Liability for injury to stock by dogs.
    The owner or keeper of any dog shall be liable to the owner of any animal killed or injured by such dog for the amount of damages sustained and costs of collection, to be recovered in a civil action.
    [1985 c 415 14; 1929 c 198 5; RRS 3106. Prior: 1919 c 6 5; RCS 3106.]

    16.08.020
    Dogs injuring stock may be killed.
    It shall be lawful for any person who shall see any dog or dogs chasing, biting, injuring or killing any sheep, swine or other domestic animal, including poultry, belonging to such person, on any real property owned or leased by, or under the control of, such person, or on any public highway, to kill such dog or dogs, and it shall be the duty of the owner or keeper of any dog or dogs so found chasing, biting or injuring any domestic animal, including poultry, upon being notified of that fact by the owner of such domestic animals or poultry, to thereafter keep such dog or dogs in leash or confined upon the premises of the owner or keeper thereof, and in case any such owner or keeper of a dog or dogs shall fail or neglect to comply with the provisions of this section, it shall be lawful for the owner of such domestic animals or poultry to kill such dog or dogs found running at large.
    [1929 c 198 6; RRS 3107. Prior: 1919 c 6 6; 1917 c 161 6; RCS 3107.]

    16.08.030
    Marauding dog Duty of owner to kill.
    It shall be the duty of any person owning or keeping any dog or dogs which shall be found killing any domestic animal to kill such dog or dogs within forty-eight hours after being notified of that fact, and any person failing or neglecting to comply with the provisions of this section shall be deemed guilty of a misdemeanor, and it shall be the duty of the sheriff or any deputy sheriff to kill any dog found running at large (after the first day of August of any year and before the first day of March in the following year) without a metal identification tag.
    [1929 c 198 7; RRS 3108. Prior: 1919 c 6 7; 1917 c 161 7; RCS 3108.]

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Delton, Michigan
    Posts
    17,476
    bill is right for animals that are doing harm to live stock!!!! but you had better have proof of such,, dead or injured stock.. i had that happen to me several years ago,, had a nice husky malumut with a collar come in and take out some rabbits we had, left some and i got the dog trapped in the shed tied a bottle/w/ a note to him and told the owner to take care of it or i would. well got some more rabbits and they came back a week later! got the dog tied it up and called the law.. state police.. they told me i could dispose of the dog ,,the owner had come looking for it as soon as they knew it was missing ands i was where they came.. the officer told her that i could dispose of it or she could and i had the choice,, i told her the rabbits were worth this much and i would take that instead of the dog.. she paid the bill and the dog lived.
    If in Doubt, Build it Stout!
    One hand washes the other!
    Don't put off today till tomorrow!

  7. #7
    Maine is fortunate that it has a Right to Farm Law. Some states have this and some don't. Anyway its a powerful piece of legislation for a farmer.

    In a nut shell it allows a farmer to maintain his way of life even if it causes a nuisance for others, that is as long as it is considered a best management practice by the USDA. A good example is us spreading manure on fields. Its smelly and may bother some new comers to the area, but we cannot be stopped because it bothers these people. Its a best management practice. The same can be said for municipalities that try to ban GE food, we have the right to farm. And as it relates to this post, yes we have a right to protect our livestock from wayward dogs.

    The problem is, sometimes when you are in the right, you can still be in the wrong. The problem occurs when your sheep get out and they do damage to the neighbors yard. Its inevitable that sheep will get out at some point so unless the damage is egregious, you got to let some things go.

    The dog today was distracted, but not harassing the sheep. The hunters were happy they got their lost dog, and I was happy they were running coyotes. No one died today, unfortunately even the coyote.
    I have no intention of traveling from birth to the grave in a manicured and well preserved body; but rather I will skid in sideways, totally beat up, completely worn out, utterly exhausted and jump off my tractor and loudly yell, "Wow, this is what it took to feed a nation!"

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    new york city burbs
    Posts
    10,188
    There are just some things here a city boy like me has never even thought of.

    coyotes, someones dog killing sheep,................and all the laws governing the actions of whats legal and what isnt.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by allen levine View Post
    There are just some things here a city boy like me has never even thought of.

    coyotes, someones dog killing sheep,................and all the laws governing the actions of whats legal and what isnt.
    Allen, there is a slow change that's occurring and I don't mean this in a bad way, its just a learning curve that both city folk and country people are coming to grips with. Years ago when sheep got out, or a herd of cows migrated over to the neighbors farm and got into their garden, it was dealt with differently. Those neighbors had cows too so they understood it was going to happen. The people would replace the food with stuff for their own garden and things were relatively civil between neighbors.

    Now we are trying to farm with city folk who have moved in. When we drive by hauling tons of cow manure and spreading it on fields, they want all that smell, flys and truck traffic stopped. So they do what they have always done. Call the police and try and have a cease and desist order put on us.

    For the longest time here, how that played out all depended on local ordinances, and who was in control of the local government. If they liked the farmer, nothing was done, but if the farmer was disliked it could be a real pain for him to farm like he had always done. With The Right to Farm Act, it just kind of spells things out better on a state-wide scale.

    For farmers it's not an end-all/be-all law. You have to play by the rules too. For instance my sheep fence does not qualify as either coyote-proof or as a perimeter fence so I cannot go to the game wardens and say I am having coyote problems as I am not adequately protecting my sheep as per USDA best management practices. That cow manure I talked about earlier, we have to have a Comprehensive Nutrient Management Plan in place to show that we are indeed spreading the fertilizer appropriately. In other words, you have to farm right to stand behind the law.

    Now don't get me wrong. This is not a city-folk versus country-folk thing. People moving in from away are inevitable, we just have to adapt our farming methods to all get along here.
    I have no intention of traveling from birth to the grave in a manicured and well preserved body; but rather I will skid in sideways, totally beat up, completely worn out, utterly exhausted and jump off my tractor and loudly yell, "Wow, this is what it took to feed a nation!"

  10. #10
    I should clarify something here as far as sheep predators go. There is a big difference between coyotes and domestic dogs, and why each is their own seperate issue.

    Coyotes kill sheep. They are hungry and need something to eat. If they are starving or trying to feed young, then its going to take more then a good fence and close proximity to a house to stop that. But a sheep farmer can deter them by using guard animals that let the coyote know that he's wasting his time. If he can be told via guard dog, donkey or llama that an easier meal can be had elsewhere, he will leave the sheep alone. Its interesting to note that my Grandparent, in 30 years of sheep rearing never lost a sheep to a coyote.

    Now domestic dogs is a bigger problem. Now not so much where I live because no one around here has dogs. More then likely the hunting dogs that came through would not bother the sheep because they are well trained and are routinely allowed to do what dogs are supposed to do...hunt, and hunt a specific animal (coyote). Its the dogs that are penned up as pets that cause the most harm. That is because they don't go after the sheep to kill them for food, they just chase them. Once caught they maim and maul them in an effort to play or whatever, but they don't kill.

    Domestic dogs are tough to stop because they are getting to do something they never do...run and chase. A guard animal has a hard time stopping domestic dogs because they are on a full charge with enthusiasm and pent up aggression and can do this any time during the day or night. A coyote on the other hand is simply being told "easier food can be found elsewhere" and typically attacks just before dawn. Interestingly enough, its often the small toy dog breeds that cause the most problems. Its also tough for a sheep farmer to explain to a dog owner that cute fluffy maimed three sheep.

    So how does hunting play into all this? Well that's interesting too. If a hunter kills a alpha coyote that has learned "easier food can be found elsewhere", then the sheep farmer ends up with more problems then he had before. Those alpha coyotes tend to keep the other coyotes in check. As long as the hunting pressure is high, and the coyote population is constantly limited by hunting, hunting is effective. BUT if for any reason that hunting pressure is eased, a sheep farmer will be inundated with coyote problems. In other words, you got to hunt them hard, or not at all.
    I have no intention of traveling from birth to the grave in a manicured and well preserved body; but rather I will skid in sideways, totally beat up, completely worn out, utterly exhausted and jump off my tractor and loudly yell, "Wow, this is what it took to feed a nation!"

Similar Threads

  1. Very ni,ce afternoon
    By Dave Hawksford in forum Off Topic Discussion
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 01-28-2011, 05:44 PM
  2. An afternoon of pen/pencil fun
    By John Bartley in forum Lathe Project Showcase
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 12-22-2008, 11:13 PM
  3. What I did on my Sunday afternoon.....
    By Joan Keeler in forum Lathe Project Showcase
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 10-22-2008, 10:53 PM
  4. Been doing a Stu this afternoon.
    By Chas Jones in forum General Woodturning Q&A
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 02-03-2008, 02:52 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •