Cabinet project

I've been building some kitchen cabinets for a remodel I'm doing and reached a point where I need a little input from the group.:thumb: One of the upper cabinets will be in a corner over a shallow base unit by there self. That upper is going to have a wine rack with a shelf above it. The upper cabinet inside dimensions are 29 1/2"Hx31"Wx10 1/2"D. The wine rack is made of a front and rear grid that are identical with an opening of 4"x4" in each square. To properly support a variety of wine bottles, what would you make the depth of the grid? If I place the front grid flush to the front of the shelf (face frame added later) and I put the rear grid all the way to the back of the cabinet, it seems that the bottles could slide forward and fall. I tried setting the rear grid forward about 2" and it seems to carry the bottles better but is this the way it's done?:huh: :dunno:Below is a few photos to peruse (sorry.. forgot the popcorn):D


17 assorted boxes ready for assembly
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They take up a lot of room...
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The wine cabinet is the one on top
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After some layout and trial and error I got the first grid assembled
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Cutting out the second grid
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Had to see if it was even going to work. Just hate working w/o plans:(
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It looks like it could hold about 24 bottles of wine. (if I get it anchored good):D
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There is to be a shelf added above the rack. I'm planning on making a grooved frame around each grid to make it a little nicer.:p
 
That is a nice size shop you appear to have there Royall. I can tell, because despite all the boxes you have built it still appears roomy. It also appears that you have a wee project going on there.

I can't help you with the wine grid and it does not appear you need any help. Maybe others like Robert Schaubhut can help. Don't hold back on your posting, it appears you have been sandbagging on us.:) Give us a few details on your construction details. I know I am interested.
 
Royall,

I think you've got plenty of support. Are the spaces too big? Could you get more bottles in if they were smaller? Also, wouldn't it be good to continue the grid all the way to the top of the box? If it were attached all around, would that give more strength?

Would it be possible, and worth the effort, to rout some minor detail into each piece, just to dress it up a little?

The whole project looks great so far! Good work!

Thanks,

Bill
 
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Bill Satko: That is a nice size shop you appear to have there Royall. I can tell, because despite all the boxes you have built it still appears roomy. It also appears that you have a wee project going on there.


Thanks for the warm fuzzies Bill,:) the shop is 20x28 and still not set up in an easy use form yet. I need to find out what I'll be using it for mostly and tailor it to that job I think. It wasn't meant to be for making a living from but right now that is what it is. I want to learn how to use the used lathe I bought and make some spinny things:D

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Bill Arnold: One good option is to make the grid from solid pieces rather than the lattice. That way, any size bottle will be fully supported.


I was thinking of going with a solid unit like what Robert built. With the easy to follow directions he posted while making his it would have been easier for me to figure out:D but the customer brought me a magazine with a itty bitty photo and said they wanted something like that:( The customer gets what they want. :thumb:

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Bill Lantry: I think you've got plenty of support. Are the spaces too big? Could you get more bottles in if they were smaller? Also, wouldn't it be good to continue the grid all the way to the top of the box? If it were attached all around, would that give more strength?


I came up with 4" spaces because that is about what was in the photo:eek: as it is there is room for just about 24 bottles, more than enough to get me on my lips:rofl: but I don't want to get it too heavy as I have to mount it to a wall that is made of foam and concrete. It's called Castle Block here and I'm still working on that problem:D I would have made the grid to the top of the box but the customer wants a shelf like in the photo. If I think of it I'll scan the photo and post it. The grid is made of 3/4" poplar cut to 3/4" wide strips. I'm planning to make a boarder for the grid of 1"x1/2" poplar with a 1/4" groove to wrap each grid to give it a cleaner look than what the mitered ends are right now. As far as strength goes when the upper shelf is in it will be as strong as it would be going to the top:thumb:

Would it be possible, and worth the effort, to rout some minor detail into each piece, just to dress it up a little?

If I was an artisan I would add some detail but I can just see me screwing things up trying to get too fancy:rofl::rofl: I'd be happy to listen to any suggestion though:thumb: The other thing I have to consider is all the cabinets are to be painted an off white inside and out:( Geez it hate painting:doh:

The whole project looks great so far! Good work!

Thanks Bill, Bill, and Bill for all the good words. I'll try to keep the photos coming and will listen to any advise.:thumb: This is only my 3rd set of kitchen cabinets and my first for money:eek:
 
I suppose you have estimated the weight of the wine, but if you have not, I did a little searching and come up with:

750ml ... 3lbs each
Champange or Liter ...4lbs each

Using 750ml bottles that would be 72 llbs for 24. About the same as all the dishes that were in Bill Lantry's kitchen cabinet...maybe a little less.:D
 
Royall,

Looking real nice there my friend. That's a decent project you got going.

Nice shop too. Needless to say, I am jealous, but we have talked about that already.

As for the wine rack, I think you have the right idea, and I agree that if the back grid isn't close enough to the front, bottles might slide off. I would make sure there is at lease 2 inches of engagement on the average bottle. As long as the base of the neck cannot slide forward any, that should hold the bottles securely. Some bottles have a straighter, narrower body and could be a problem if they slid out, but bottles like that should be placed on the botton of the rack, IMHO. As long as the bottles can touch the back of the cabinet and the necks rest properly on the front grid, you should be OK.

As to some decoration on the grid, what would it look like if you used a 1/4" radius roundover bit with a fairly large diameter bearing, so you could not go all the way into each corner, and just did an incomplete roundover in each bottle hole of the grid? You would have a little variation to accent it but not be a complicated job to do. Just my thoughts.

Oh and as Bill points out, there will be substantial weight with a fully loaded rack. I think you have enough support and it probably won't be full all the time anyway. Can you mount it on french cleats that can be screwed with shields and also glued to the wall? That might give you more support.

Keep up the good work. I'll be interested in seeing it progress to completion. I am sure your customer will be pleased.

Be talking to ya again sometime Brah.

Aloha, Tony
 
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I suppose you have estimated the weight of the wine, but if you have not, I did a little searching and come up with:

750ml ... 3lbs each
Champange or Liter ...4lbs each

Using 750ml bottles that would be 72 llbs for 24. About the same as all the dishes that were in Bill Lantry's kitchen cabinet...maybe a little less.:D

What, Me plan ahead:eek: Didn't even think about checking the weight.

I'm thinking of using a tile blade in my worm drive and inlaying a couple of pieces of 1x4 into the wall with epoxy or construction adhesive. If I use several screws into the 1x4's hopefully that will take care of the weight. Right/wrong??
 
... I was thinking of going with a solid unit like what Robert built. With the easy to follow directions he posted while making his it would have been easier for me to figure out:D but the customer brought me a magazine with a itty bitty photo and said they wanted something like that:( The customer gets what they want. :thumb:
Amen on the customer getting what they want! :thumb:

If I ever have a need to build wine rack, I'd follow the design David Marks did on one of his show. Here's what it looks like. A design like this allows any size bottle to be stacked within each cubicle.
photo.asp
 
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Got out to the shop for a while this afternoon and worked on the wine rack some more. Still a ways off to installing it. The fit is a bit tight and after it's painted it will get tighter so I'll have to trim a bit off the outer frame. The boxes are all 3/4" birch ply made from plans that Danny Proulx published a few years ago. There are no cut outs for the toe kick but usually sit on adjustable plastic legs. There will be granite counter tops this time so I installed 5" tall 2 by material on the concrete slab to set the cabinets on.

Still need to make the face frames for the pantry and wine rack and the I'll be able to start the painting... Didn't I mention earlier I hate painting??:D

set up for making the frame of the rack
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final profile
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Checking the fit
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miter glue up
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adding the decorative edge
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close up of the 1/4" round over
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dry fit to see what it's going to look like
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Looking good Royall,

I like how you worked out my suggestion. Rael nice job.

Keep up the good work. It's too bad it needs to be painted. Looks better natural.

Aloha, Tony
 
Well Christmas is over and back into the shop. The guys that I'm building the cabinets for came by to see their cabinets and was excited to see the wine rack. They liked the natural look and decided to NOT paint the interior:D I was so happy with that decision:thumb: Much rather squirt lacquer than paint. I was slowed down a bit as it has been raining here so much that I didn't think the lacquer would do too well with the high humidity. I went ahead and got the shelves banded and sanded while waiting for the sun and breezes. Finally the weather changed for a while and I got the grille work and box finished out for the wine cabinet before the clouds thickened up again. But it is together and ready to be installed. The bead board trim still needs to be installed on the right side but I'll do that after the box is hung. The face frame and bead board will be painted white.


I did a dry fit for the customers.
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Banding the shelves. Don't look at the mess on the bench!
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This is a shot of one of my most used home builds. It is a ros stand that I made about nine or ten years ago. I can turn the ros off and while it is still spinning set it down with out it jumping all over the place. The coffee can lid absorbs the energy of the sander with out marring anything or tipping over. Works well with my old Mikita and DeWalt both.
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Now we move to the portable paint booth:rofl: Got a lazy susan to help move the work piece around. The blocks with the nail in them are to hold up the shelves while I finish the second side, it leaves a very small indentation in the finish. Really can't see it and I finish the bottom side first.
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Finished and waiting for it's new home.
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Thanks for following along.
 
Is that your shop iron or did you sneak into the house and get that?

Looks really nice. Are you happy with how the bottles fit?

Bill I learned a long time ago DON'T TOUCH THE WIFE'S IRON
I bought that one two kitchens ago.:D

I still like the way the bottles fit. I could have gone a bit smaller but the fit looks better in person than in the photo:dunno:. The photos make the bottles look so small.:huh:

Thanks for the kind works Chuck:thumb:
 
O. K. Royall, I have a few questions. Why not offset the front grid upwards so the bottles are tilted up and won't slide out. Secondly, if you were to slip when sliding a bottle out wouldn't it drop down on the bottle below it and possibly break it. I'm not trying to be a pain with these questions. My brother is doing a major remodel including the kitchen and wants me to build him a wine rack. I haven't given it much thought yet but since you brought it up.:D
 
O. K. Royall, I have a few questions. Why not offset the front grid upwards so the bottles are tilted up and won't slide out. Secondly, if you were to slip when sliding a bottle out wouldn't it drop down on the bottle below it and possibly break it. I'm not trying to be a pain with these questions. My brother is doing a major remodel including the kitchen and wants me to build him a wine rack. I haven't given it much thought yet but since you brought it up.:D

Hi Paul, the grid is set up the way it is to keep the bottle tipped down to keep the cork moist. I guess it is a moot point anymore as more and more wine is corked with plastic corks. The shoulder of the bottle keeps it from sliding out of the grid. If it did slip out of your hand I don't think it would go very far unless you didn't keep very much wine in place. Wine bottles are quite tough it would take a heck of a bump to break one. You could build on like Robert did with solid material but this is what the customers wanted. I aim to please:D
 
Thanks for the reply Royall. I guess I exposed my ignorance in the fermented fruit department. I have certainly seen wine racks built the way you did. My brother wants one to attach to the end of the kitchen cabinets. I thought about making a circular array rack, but I may have to figure out a 2 sided arrangement with bottles 90 degrees too each other. I thought about making the racks with circular half cut-outs to capture either the neck or the bottle base, but I see know that a grid makes more sense because I'm sure not all bottles are the same diameter. I need to make a sharp looking rack because my brother is a design engineer and a compulsive perfectionist.
 
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