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Thread: Sharpening-Thompson Gouge-Jet Wet grinder

  1. #1
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    Sharpening-Thompson Gouge-Jet Wet grinder

    Background with a shapening Question

    I needed a new gouge and bought one of the Thompson Gouges and a nice handle from Monster. First let me say what great service and fast shipping they both had. I unpacked it and put the two together on my first day off which was today. Went out to the garage and put a pc of mesquite up on my Jet lathe and took the gouge for a trial run. For the fun of it i started with taking the bark off and rounding it. This tool is exceptional and cut like no gouge i have used before (ok ok ok so i only had Harbor freight general lathe HSS tools to compare to in terms of gouges ). I Really had a ball turning it round and shaping the outside.
    Then changed over to my Ci1 to cut the tennon. Why? as i rounded the end of the blank with the Thompson it was like this.......catch......catch.......catch.....catch. ...stall.....catch ....stall...........hummmm not so good with it right now.......but its a learning curve so i took out my Ci1 cut the tennon and reveresed it in my Supernova chuck.........
    Let the hollowing begin......ok well i really suck at using it right now and i found out how much i need to practice......I kept getting catches and stopping the lathe from hitting it with the tip or holding it wrong.
    Back to the Grumbine/Raffan DVD's I guess............
    A few cuts went well and alot of cuts stopped the lathe. Eventually i got it hollowed out and used my big ole bowl scrapper to take a few finish cuts......Sanded to 320,Antique Oil,Stain,several coats of Laquer and will let sit and buff later...........

    Problems and Questions

    1). Im not sure how to go about sharpening this gouge when its time to sharpen. I have been using a Jet Wet grinder (see pic below) with the angle attachement but i put the Thompson in it and held it to the grinder and i am having trouble figuring out the correct angle. I have manipulated the angle of the jig, the rest and shortened and extended the tool in the jig but......I am still leary of trying this new gouge as i do not want to screw up the grind that it came with.......any comments ???

    What i want is to achieve the exact same angle grind on this tool everytime because i love how it cuts.

    In the pic below it has another tool in it just for the sake of illustrating the setup.
    Aside from the above i am having a issue with the grinder itself.....I have redressed the wheel the other day and now the dang thing is running fast and slow on its own...speeds up and slows....its like something is making it drag at times...or like tensioning it on and off quickly...... I have the tension backed all the way off and speed all the way up to..........anyway.........Thoughts ????

    Pictures 1-3 show the grinder and setup with HSS tool in it for illustration purposes
    Pictures 4-6 is the Thompson with the Monster hanlde - Got the larger handle and loving every min of holding it.........LOL
    Pictures 7 & 8 show the bowl i was talking about with a experimental finish - you will see that the edge of the bowl and comming in to the inside is a bit concave and i dont think i sanded it well enough in a couple areas - see the upper right hand inside of the bowl for very darken areas that took the stain darker.
    Picture 9 - Big Ole' Scrapper as i call it....bought the scrapper unhandled and stuck it to a handle i hand laying around
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Jet-1 (600 x 450).jpg   Jet-Gouge-1 (600 x 450).jpg   Jet-Gouge-2 (600 x 450).jpg   Thompson-1 (600 x 450).jpg   Thompson-2 (600 x 450).jpg  

    Thompson-3 (600 x 450).jpg   Wavey-1 (600 x 450).jpg   Wavey-2 (600 x 450).jpg   Scapper-Ci1 (450 x 600).jpg  
    Last edited by Dan Mosley; 04-10-2009 at 04:12 AM.

  2. #2
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    Dan, I'm not familiar with the Jet sharpening jigs, but based on the Tormek gouge jig I use, I think you have the jig 180 backward. Look at your third picture above, then check out the picture #3 in the middle of this page:

    http://www.tormek.com/en/woodturning/

    Notice how the "elbow" is pointed in opposite directions in the two pictures.

    The catches are likely a combination of the angle of your grind (it looks a bit steep from what I can see in the pics) and a matter of experience getting the hang of using the gouge.

    I don't have any pics handy pf the grind I have on my gouges, but they match the pictures that Doug sends with the Thompson gouges pretty closely.
    When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. - Hunter S. Thompson
    When the weird get going, they start their own forum. - Vaughn McMillan

    workingwoods.com

  3. #3
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    I agree the jig set up may have been reversed. In principle, it is the same set up as Varigrind. I have done some experiment with the different jig setting with Varigrind. If you set up the leg so far forward, the grind will be too weir to be useful.

    The bowl you are doing has under cut rim. It is difficult to ride the bevel. Even you have enough clearance from the rim, you have to make a big and quick swing in the handle to keep bevel contact. Without bevel control, it is easy to have catches. You said you only have HF gouges to compare it to; this is your first bowl gouge. I would suggest you try out the new bowl gouge with a less challenging shape, like a shallow open bowl first.

    Last edited by Gordon Seto; 04-10-2009 at 05:22 AM.
    Gordon

  4. #4
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    I agree with Gordon and Vaughn. On a under cut lip as you have on the bowl I use a bowl gouge with a conventional grind and not the swept back. I also use a 55* or less bevel. It is a P & N bowl gouge. I have the 1/2" and the 3/8". I use these for my final cuts on a bowl much the way I saw Mike Mahoney do. The bowl you are doing is really hard to ride the bevel without large swings of the handle especially on a flat bottom. I also agree with Vaughn that it looks to me like your jig is 180* out.
    Bernie W.

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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gordon Seto View Post
    You said you only have HF gouges to compare it to; this is your first bowl gouge. I would suggest you try out the new bowl gouge
    I don't have that jig or that grinder. But I started with the HF set, and then moved up too. One thing I did when I first got better gouges was to play with the HF set and the jig I got. By that point, the HF set was pretty much sacrificial, so I completely reground their shapes to figure out how to grind the new ones, I was terrified of regrinding the new (good) gouges before I did that, mainly because I didn't want to mess up the angle, but afterwards my comfort level went way up...

    Thanks,

    Bill
    Last edited by Bill Lantry; 04-10-2009 at 06:01 PM.

  6. #6
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    I hope my post didn't seem to be looking down upon HF tools.
    My point is the HF set does NOT include any bowl gouge. A bowl gouge is different than a spindle gouge; the side grind angles are very different. The gouge has to be rolled a lot to match the same cutting angle.
    Doug Thompson & I belong to the same Clubs. He has milled some look alike gouges for me to study on tool grinds. I have both his U & V flute gouges (made out of hot roll steel) and grind with various sharpening jig settings. Unfortunately I took it to our Club meeting, someone thought they were the real thing and stole couple of them.


    The gouge on the right is the U and on the left is the V. They have the same nose angle, same jig setting on the Varigrind, same fingernail shape top view. But you can't get the same grind. The side grind cheeks are different.
    I have to show the picture of this pair, because part of the pair in the better grind model has been stolen. BTW, this pair has the 55 degree nose angle and Varigrind setting on the 3rd notch from top. If you drop the leg of the jig, you will get the longer side grind with the same nose angle.
    Gordon

  7. #7
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    Thanks for the pictures, Gordon. I was also going to mention the difference between the gouges in the HF set and a true bowl gouge.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gordon Seto View Post
    I... Unfortunately I took it to our Club meeting, someone thought they were the real thing and stole couple of them.
    I guess they'll get their payback when they try to keep that hot rolled steel sharp, huh?
    When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. - Hunter S. Thompson
    When the weird get going, they start their own forum. - Vaughn McMillan

    workingwoods.com

  8. #8
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    With the sharpening jig so close to the wheel, I believe that will be similar to the Varigrind jig setting to the number 7 (bottom) notch from the top. On a bowl gouge, it will have very long side grind. This pair was not stolen either.

    U on the right; V on the left.
    It also has the same 55 degree nose angle, same stick out as in the other picture. The only variable is the Jig Setting. Because of the long side grind, the U gouge doesn't have the high shearing angle which some turners like the U gouge for finish cuts for inside of the bowl.
    The lower the Jig Setting number, the shorter the side grind (closer to traditional grind). The high shearing angle would give a cleaner finish cut.
    Gordon

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