school?

tod evans

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ozarks
marty and i have contemplated teaching classes together for a while, just wondering if ya`ll think we could make a few bucks as a traveling circus?
what does the collective group have to say?
 
Probably too far for me, but there is no denying that the two of you have much to offer anyone learning to raise their woodworking skill level.
 
I don't know, Tod. What with Marty's inability to build anything substantial, :doh: and your plainness of work and design, :rolleyes: I would doubt anyone would be interested.

:eek: NO NO, JUST KIDDING. :rofl::rofl::rofl:

I think (Truthfully this time) :thumb: you are two of the most likely to succeed at this. If I wanted to learn the craftsmanship you and Marty excel at, I would also pay to study under you guys. (It's just too bad I didn't know you when I was younger)

Go for it. Let me be one of the first to congratulate you on a brilliant idea. :clap:

Aloha, Tony
 
Teaching woodworking is a tough business. Well, maybe I should re-phrase that: getting students to pay for woodworking instruction is a tough business.

The people who do the best have "names". They've published in magazines and maybe wrote books, and have won awards for their work. They're known in the woodworking community.

If you're going to teach at your location, the cost to a student is substantial. They have to take time off work, pay for their travel, lodging and food, and pay for the course.

I teach weekend courses at Woodcraft and we have trouble getting enough people to fill a class. And all they have to pay for is the class. Since it's the weekend, they don't have to take time off work, and their only travel is to drive to the store. And this is an highly populated area so there's a lot of woodworkers in the area.

It's expensive to set up a school (all the tools for each student) and you have the liability problem if any of them get hurt.

Good luck in your endeavor.

Mike
 
Hey everyone...

Thanks for the few votes of confidence for tod and I having a go at this.

Mike, you bring up several of the major issues that we've discussed already. Getting folks to say "I'd attend", and getting those same folks to commit their time and money to a class are two completely different things!

We acknowledge that we're not 'published', we don't have TV shows, and the only awards we've won are the checks/cash from happy clients that have purchased our stuff. But then again, we're not looking to start an accredited school and teach thousands of students a year. Well wait a minute...let me do the math...:huh: Heck, we'll teach as many students as want to pay us! :D

We're in the process of discussing a bunch of different options, including course material, locations, class duration, etc. We'd love to hear from any of you that have suggestions, questions, and/or requests.

What do y'all wanna learn about?

(Please direct all spinny questions to Larry :stick:)

Thanks...
- Marty -
 
Hey everyone...

Thanks for the few votes of confidence for tod and I having a go at this.

Mike, you bring up several of the major issues that we've discussed already. Getting folks to say "I'd attend", and getting those same folks to commit their time and money to a class are two completely different things!

We acknowledge that we're not 'published', we don't have TV shows, and the only awards we've won are the checks/cash from happy clients that have purchased our stuff. But then again, we're not looking to start an accredited school and teach thousands of students a year. Well wait a minute...let me do the math...:huh: Heck, we'll teach as many students as want to pay us! :D

We're in the process of discussing a bunch of different options, including course material, locations, class duration, etc. We'd love to hear from any of you that have suggestions, questions, and/or requests.

What do y'all wanna learn about?

(Please direct all spinny questions to Larry :stick:)

Thanks...
- Marty -
i thought i heard the thunder and felt the earth shake!!!!!:eek::eek::eek: bougtht time yu came back to rein in the flock some:D
 
Someday, when the kids are grown perhaps, I might take a class on turning. But then, I might just figure it out for myself by reading, watching videos, talking to friends and experimenting. That's what I've done for basically everything else.

(Heck, if Stu can do it, so can I... ;):wave:)


Actually the woodcraft route is possibly not a bad idea -- give some classes there and maybe it'll lead to more lucrative one-on-one training. Ditto for wood shows, or giving talks at local woodworking/woodturning guilds. Learning to sell yourself is the trick, I suspect.
 
just an idea, not sure if it is valid.
Alot of schools, high schools on LI have shop class.just using LI as example, since I live here.
Im sure most of them have tools, although maybe not a great selection, they have equipment.
There are zero woodworking classes in adult education courses .Zero.
There are booklets of classes from each high school district up here for adult ed classes, everything from learning how to waltz , eating healthy, to doing your own taxes, crocheting, quilt making, and every language.
Would it be so out of line for 2 guys who can obviously get some kind of certification to teach adult ed, use the schools workshops at night, bring in their own equipment, and most likelywill have to secure their own liability insurance.
The school would be making money, something they all need desperately these days, and there would be plenty of advertising in the schools adult ed books. I dont think people who teach adult ed courses are teachers or certified or licensed teachers, they are just experts in their fields, like insurance, accountants, etc......yet they must bring in some nice cash since the classes hold up to 30 people and charge up to 30-40 bucks for a 90 minute class.
I understand a woodworking class would be more money, but if 10 students registered, at 50-75 dollars for a 90 minute class, well, its just a thought. I dont know if it is possible.
I know going for a few night courses is alot easier than having to travel to another state. The school may only charge 500 dollars for a 5 day course, but food, lodging and transportation could run another 1000 bucks.
 
Someday, when the kids are grown perhaps, I might take a class on turning. But then, I might just figure it out for myself by reading, watching videos, talking to friends and experimenting. That's what I've done for basically everything else.

.

I watched videos, and even though my health limited my fun one night, there is nothing in the world like a class where theres hands on training, intimate training with an instructor standing next to you pointing out things like turn the gouge a bit more up, or hold you hands a bit straighter, tighter, that happened because you did this or that, you cannot get that from any video, only a long time of bad habits and probably alot of mistakes, god forbid injuries also.
My woodturning class was a blast.
IF woodcraft would bother to open a store on LI, Id be there often for their woodworking classes.
 
Tod...

You're certainly good at what you do, we've all seen that. And you know how to help people learn, we've all seen that. I have to agree with those who are throwing some caution out there, which doesn't translate to dumb idea, forget it. I was a software guy, but I taught programming courses at night for a few years...loved it. I think it would be a double hoot to have a woodworking school. But I think you won't be successful for awhile, so you need to be able to support that transition on your own. My guess is I'm not telling you anything you haven't thought of.

Maybe you could contact Gary Rogowski or Marc Adams or guys at that level and ask about teaching for them. Even if they turn you down, make them tell you the reasons for doing so (no openings at the moment isn't acceptable...really, why). This could give you some insight into areas that might need shoring up. Or teach locally for awhile, as someone suggested. When you send out your pamphlets that have pictures of you two and your list of credentials, that could help. Maybe you could get in touch with someone who could help market your school without breaking the bank...marketing it and running it requires two different skill sets.

All that said, I wholeheartedly wish you guys good luck. I expect the forum will be kept up to date on your progress.

Cheers.
 
My thoughts are that you would need to get your names recognized first. Maybe follow somewhat in the footsteps of Marc Spagnuolo aka "The Wood Whisperer". Marty, you have the knowhow to set all that up. Rig up something remote for Tod, and teach that way some. Or do weekend video sessions to do the videos at one shop or the other. Get sponsors like Marc has, Mini Max comes to mind:thumb::rofl:, and build a base of followers...that builds name recognition. Once you have that, you may need to do some traveling with the wood shows, and further build your name recognition. In other words, start small and build.
While you both have people here that would love to learn from you, that is a pretty small group of people. I don't think we could keep you two in business. The Woodcraft idea is a good one. You could start with one local to you, and build from there. Do good, get some turn out, and the owner/managers can help you with other stores. I bet most of their stores are close to where one or more of us live, and I know I'd be more than happy to give you a place to crash for a weekend.
I think you should go for it if you truly want to do this sort of thing. Like most worthwhile endeavors though, it's not going to be instant gratification. It will take a while. Jim.
 
... getting students to pay for woodworking instruction is a tough business.

... the cost to a student is substantial. They have to take time off work, pay for their travel, lodging and food, and pay for the course.

I teach weekend courses at Woodcraft and we have trouble getting enough people to fill a class. And all they have to pay for is the class. Since it's the weekend, they don't have to take time off work, and their only travel is to drive to the store. And this is an highly populated area so there's a lot of woodworkers in the area.

Unfortunately Mike's experiences are probably uniform across the country and point out a common flaw of thinking among most woodworkers. That is the belief that we can somehow buy a tool that will make us better woodworkers. Or maybe it is just the case that we are really not woodworkers but tool collectors. Irregardless, we prefer to procure tools and are unwilling to spend money on instruction. How many of us have contemplated taking a woodworking class, but then dismissed it when you found out the price, thinking what tool you could buy instead?

I am as guilty as anyone else, but decided last year to take a different tack. This year I have taken classes from Jim Tolpin (Port Townsend School of Woodworking) and Gary Rogowski (Northwest Woodworking Studio). I am scheduled to go back to the Port Townsend school this fall to take two classes with Garrett Hack who is visiting the area. This November Rob Cosman is coming to Seattle and I signed up for a two day demonstration with him.

This is costing me some money. Money that I set aside to purchase some tools with, but I do not regret it because I firmly believe that I am advancing my abilities much faster this way.

I would strongly suggest that if you are in a position to, taking some instruction is the way to go.

Good luck Marty and Tod. Although it would be nice to take a class from the two of you, the economics just don't make sense for me when I have two great woodworkers in my backyard.
 
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All the best to you both, If I wasn't so far away I woudn't mind spending a few days learning new things or improving the ones I know from you.

However, apart from what has been said, I would think locally at start and find out if local woodworkers say people 25-30 miles around that could drive back and forth each day would be a potential source of students.

Then, ( and I guess you've done it already) I would find if there are any other schools around because you will be competing with them.

So the key questions would be:
Are woodworking lessons in demand in my area?
Is that need already being fullfilled? To what extent? With what success?
Has anybody asked or insinuated privately that they'd like to get lessons from you and be willing to pay for it? What can I offer that the others don't?

I'm sure that you've asked them already but I think that insisting on them will not make any harm.

Good luck to both and maybe I'll enrol in 2011 term.:thumb::thumb:
 
I've been trying to think of a good reply.
Thus far, two main thoughts are bouncing around my cranium.
#1) Yer about as well qualified to do this as they come.
#2) The undertaking would be very complex. Major business considerations, lesson plans, promotion and advertising (and we both know just how much you love advertising :rolleyes: ), travel, demo tools, etc., etc.
Methinks a fixed location with folks coming to you instead of you going around the country would work best. In the non-summer months, local motels would give good rates.
 
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