Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Unhinged

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Constantine, MI
    Posts
    6,973

    Unhinged

    I asked this question http://familywoodworking.org/forums/...ead.php?t=1436 over in flat work showcase but have yet to see anyone address it......so......I though I would post it here in the Q&A section to see what the fallout might be.

    My bathroom cabinet is nearing completion and I have yet to make a decision on hinges for the door. I'm concerned that the shallow shelves, and the 'stuff' they will hold, I intended to attach to the inside of the door will place too much stress on the hinge screws (the door frame is pine). My thought was to use a piano hinge but I'm not sure how this will look. My first choice would have been a pair of no-mortise hinges with some form of decorative finial.

    I've seen the postings here and know that most all of you have a better eye for these things than I do. Please help me out with some suggestions. Am I overly concerned about the screws pulling out of the pine?

    How about another option? While sitting out in the shop starring at the cabinet last night it occurred to me that I should build the shelf as a separate unit and hinge it to the inside of the plywood 'inner cabinet' much like what is done for kitchen pantry cabinets. This would allow a more decorative hinge for the door and eliminate any concern for over stressing the hinge screws. I'm leaning this way - anyone want to give me a push?

    Thanks!
    Last edited by Rennie Heuer; 02-15-2007 at 01:23 PM.
    “We all die. The goal isn't to live forever; the goal is to create something that will.” - Chuck Palahniuk

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    535
    Any chance you can use mortise hinges? The edges of the leaves bear directly on the bottom side of the mortises, and the screws mostly just hold the leaf in the mortise. From what you describe, there's not a huge amount of weight so even small ones would be ok.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Placitas, NM in the foothills of the Sandia Mt
    Posts
    688
    Hey Rennie,
    Here's a completely different idea. I'm planning to build a hanging tool case out of some wormy maple, inspired by an article Chris Schwartz wrote in Pop Woodworking a while back. Found some nice strap hinges at Lee Valley.

    http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/pa...=3,41241,41262

    They go really nice with the wormy maple.

    Great project you have there, can't wait to see it finished
    Don't believe everything you think!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Constantine, MI
    Posts
    6,973
    Quote Originally Posted by John Downey View Post
    Any chance you can use mortise hinges? The edges of the leaves bear directly on the bottom side of the mortises, and the screws mostly just hold the leaf in the mortise. From what you describe, there's not a huge amount of weight so even small ones would be ok.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jesse Cloud View Post
    Hey Rennie,
    Here's a completely different idea. I'm planning to build a hanging tool case out of some wormy maple, inspired by an article Chris Schwartz wrote in Pop Woodworking a while back. Found some nice strap hinges at Lee Valley.

    They go really nice with the wormy maple.

    Great project you have there, can't wait to see it finished
    John - Yes, mortised hinges are certainly an option though my concern was for the weight of the door with shelves holding saving cream, etc. pulling on the hinge. If I understand it correctly the force exerted on the screws would be more tensile than shear (hope I'm using the correct terms ). Granted, the mortise would support the hinge for shear , but would it provide any support for stress more along the axis of the screws?

    Jesse - wow. Those are some healthy looking hinges. I'll have to play with that idea and maybe do a mock-up.
    “We all die. The goal isn't to live forever; the goal is to create something that will.” - Chuck Palahniuk

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    1,487
    Rennie, You wont be putting enough weight on those shelves to be concerned with the tensile or shear strength of the screws. Any failure would come from the wood. Door hinges are normally in a shear condition. There is very little tensile stress. If you use mortise hinges, that will significantly reduce the amount of shear stress.

    If you are willing to do an experiment, take the door and the items most likely to be stored on the shelves and get the weight of the assembly. Most hinges give a weight rating that you could base your decision off of.

    Post a picture of the cabinet too, that may give some of us with little imagination an idea of what's involved!

    Good luck!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Constantine, MI
    Posts
    6,973
    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Nelson View Post
    Rennie, You wont be putting enough weight on those shelves to be concerned with the tensile or shear strength of the screws. Any failure would come from the wood. Door hinges are normally in a shear condition. There is very little tensile stress. If you use mortise hinges, that will significantly reduce the amount of shear stress.

    If you are willing to do an experiment, take the door and the items most likely to be stored on the shelves and get the weight of the assembly. Most hinges give a weight rating that you could base your decision off of.

    Post a picture of the cabinet too, that may give some of us with little imagination an idea of what's involved!

    Good luck!
    Thanks Ed. The link in the first post should take you to the pictures of the cabinet.

    The shelves will hold hair spray, deodorant, shaving cream, etc. All totaled there will be several pounds hanging out there. I should have been more clear - it was the screws pulling out of the soft pine that was concerning me the most. Hinge screws are small and I only have 3/4" of soft pine on the cabinet side of the hinge to work with.



    I'm actually starting to lean more towards my second option - building a door/shelf unit like those used in pantries. This could be made of the same birch I'm using for the drawers and the hinge would mount to the plywood inner box. I could use a piano here and not worry about the appearance as it will be on the inside. Then I am free to use what ever hinge I want on the door based on what looks best.

    Something like the interior shelves on this cabinet Attachment 4759
    Rather than the door mounted shelves on this on Attachment 4760
    Last edited by Rennie Heuer; 02-15-2007 at 04:15 PM. Reason: Add pictures
    “We all die. The goal isn't to live forever; the goal is to create something that will.” - Chuck Palahniuk

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    1,487
    I remember that cabinet now!. I still think you would be ok with the decorative hinges, but since those are full inset doors you could very easily go with the european style hinges. If you want to go with the decorative hinges and are still concerned about the pine, you could take some oak dowel and glue a plug that your hinges screws could go into.

    By the way that's going to be a real pretty cabinet! Love the birch on the doors!

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    535
    Quote:
    "If I understand it correctly the force exerted on the screws would be more tensile than shear"

    Xacally.

    Tight pilot hole, wax the screw, I think you'd be ok. I usually make my mortises so tight the hinge won't budge unless pulled directly out of the mortise.

    Big 'ol stap hinges look pretty cool too.

    John

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    2,323
    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Nelson View Post
    , but since those are full inset doors ( that is the look but I think with the 1/2" baltic birch inserts, to go back into the stud cavity, the hinge may be different)you could very easily go with the european style hinges. If you want to go with the decorative hinges and are still concerned about the pine, you could take some oak dowel and glue a plug that your hinges screws could go into.( this is a very viable option for that kind of concern. Good idea Ed! )

    By the way that's going to be a real pretty cabinet! Love the birch on the doors!
    Hi Rennie,
    If you do decide on the euro hinges, from the looks of it you will have to mount the hinge plate (box mount rather than stile mount) on the 1/2' baltic birch which makes the hinge needed a half overlay. That would allow for an 1 1/4" screw. Am I seeing this correctly? If not don't tell me, you will burst my bubble.
    Bubble Boy,
    Shaz
    I am a registered voter and you can be too. We ( registered voters ) select the moderators for this forum by voting every six months for the people we want to watch over this family forum.
    Please join me. Register now.
    Shaz
    Here is how

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •