Quality Chisels

Josh Duke

Member
Messages
16
Location
Beverly, Massachusetts
Being completely new to woodworking, I have no woodworking tools of my own. I've already narrowed down the list of planes to the ones that will suit my needs in (acoustic) guitar building, and now I need to hone in (pun intended) :doh: on some chisels.

To start, I wil only need a few and would like to buy quality. In reality, I could start off with just two, a cranked-neck chisel and a double-bevel carving chisel. However, I'd like to also get some smaller chisels for clean up of small routed channels and detail work (1/16" & 1/8").

I don't like buying junk, but I don't want to pay a ton just for a name, either. An average of $50 per chisel is reasonable to me, but will pay more if it is truly a jump in quality.

For sharpening, I am planning on going the Norton water stone route unless anyone has compelling reasons to try something else.

Thank you all for your time!

Josh
 
Josh, if I may suggest that you buy some used chisels and refurbish them. You can look around and get some great quality older chisels for not much money, you might have to make a handle or two, but by doing so they will truly become "Your" tools.

Go and read this article >>[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] Rehabilitating Old Chisels [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]by Bob Smalser <<

I think that for very little money and some work you can have some GREAT chisels.

On the other hand, if you want/need to just buy some decent quality chisels to get started, I have heard nothing but great reviews for the >> Narex Chisels << that Lee Valley sell, $35 gets you a set of four, 1/4", 1/2", 3/4" and 1".

Cheers!
[/FONT]
 
Stuart,

Thanks for the quick response! I was actually thinking about trying to find some old chisels and refurbishing them, but I just don't know what to look for; I wouldn't be able to tell if the steel was any good or not.

I've heard the same thing about those Narex chisels, but was wondering how good they could really be for that price. I guess it wouldn't hurt to pick some up - worst case, I will have some decent utility chisels...

Any tips on what to look for in old chisels?

Thanks again!

Josh
 
You are welcome Josh!

In >> THIS << article about chisels there is a list of ones to watch for that should be decent:

From my observations, anything marked ”Stanley", ”Witherby“, ”Winchester“, ”Chas Buck“ or ”White“ is going to a collector for too high a price…along with some Swan's. Older Greenlee, older (not newer) Buck, New Haven Edge, Ohio Tool, DR Barton, Underhill, Union Hardware, GI Mix, Shapleigh Hardware, Eric Anton Berg, Dickerson, Gillespie, Dixon, PS&W or PEXTO, Robt Duke, Merrill, Butcher, Hibbard OVB, Simmons Keen Kutter, Lakeside and several other old makers are every bit as good as the collector prizes and are much less expensive. Most unmarked chisels of that era were usually made by one of the above makers for some hardware store and are also generally excellent.

I hope this helps, happy hunting! :wave:
 
Stuart,

Thanks for the quick response! I was actually thinking about trying to find some old chisels and refurbishing them, but I just don't know what to look for; I wouldn't be able to tell if the steel was any good or not.

I've heard the same thing about those Narex chisels, but was wondering how good they could really be for that price. I guess it wouldn't hurt to pick some up - worst case, I will have some decent utility chisels...

Any tips on what to look for in old chisels?

Thanks again!

Josh

Josh, welcome to the Family.
For what you are looking for, antique shops and flea markets are your friends. Often you can find Neander type tools very reasonably priced. With luck you can find them cheap enough to take a chance with even if you are not fully sure of their origin. Don't be afraid to dicker and walk away if the price doesn't suit you.
 
Stuart,

That link was great. Good info and straight to the point!

Frank,

I'll have to wait until warmer weather for most flea markets around here, but there are a ton of antique shops - I never thought of checking there! Thanks!

Josh
 
Josh,
Your getting great advice on the chisels now on sharping, google "Scary Sharp". As an alternative to the stones.Several of us on here use that method.

And some of us don't!:D I am a water stone man myself. I won't start that debate, but one thing you will need to focus on is flattening the backs of old chisels. There is a method that I have not tried yet, but will someday, and that is a steel flattening plate (kanaban) with diamond paste.

http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com/Merchant/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=toolshop&Product_Code=MS-SFP200&Category_Code=&ScWidth=javascript:ScreenWidth()

It supposely does a quick job flattening the backs of old chisels.

Blacky's Boy (aka Dominic Greco) over at Woodnet, uses this technique. I have tried other methods in flattening backs and none are keepers. I have messed around a little with the flattening plate and it does look promising, but I have not done enough to give a definitive response.

As for water stones, right now I am following Stu (no, not our Stu) from Tools from Japan in his review of 1000 grit stones. I suggest you follow it. He will be reporting soon on it, right now he is teasing us with a build up. http://www.toolsfromjapan.com/wordpress/
 
Learn to sharpen on good stones, I like water, but oil are certainly good too, leave the sandpaper for sanding, :D

Don't forget when you do flatten the back of a chisel, the last inch or so is all you really need to concentrate on, not the whole back has to be perfectly flat! :thumb:
 
Ditto on the good water stones. I use Shapton water stones and like them very much. Those Narex chisels look pretty good from here. I have been using Japanese chisels but wouldn't mind getting a set of western The western have a flat back whose stability can be nice.
 
Welcome to the family. I have a full set of the Narex chisels and they come ready to use and they are deadly sharp. If you get them of just get a good starter set of used chisels it is important that you learn how to sharpen them and getting a good stone is the start. There are lots of sharpening systems and gadgets that LV sell that can help you in that area as well as a good selection of books and DVD's on the subject. :thumb:
 
Josh, Shaptons and Nortons are similar, but different. The differences are fairly subtle though. I would urge a beginner against putting up the large amount of money that Shaptons cost. Scary sharp is a good way to begin, and you can go to waterstones from there, if you find you like honing by hand.

Oil stones are more forgiving in the inexperienced hand, as they are less prone to gouging out [and getting damaged] if you happen to dig in.

I would also urge you to get a honing guide and learn with it.
 
There's a lot of different systems that work well. I have a worksharp I use for chisels, and like it fine. I also have a set of waterstones that I use to sharpen my plane blades with, and they also work great. The worksharp make some marks on the blades that aren't the nicest looking, but they're sharp/fully functional.

My suggestion is go with narex or some other economy chisel to start. Learn how to sharpen, and use them some to get a feel for what you like in a handle. Then if you feel the need, upgrade to the pricey chisels. There isn't anything better in blade quality for the high dollar chisels really. They have nicer handles, they're fully flattened and ready to use with a minor sharpening, and some might fit your hand better. They also look really nice usually. One of the few function advantages I can think of is they typically are ground a lot closer to a point on the side. This makes them better to get into tight corners, but you can grind/sand down any regular chisel like that if you want.


Other suggestion get a small 9x12 granite block. It's really useful with sandpaper for the intiial flattening of the back on any economy chisels, they're perfect if you choose the sandpaper sharpening system, and I use mine to re-flatten my water stones. Plate glass works too, but grizzly has the small granite for a reasonable price.

For the waterstones I use 1000, 4000, 8000 grits. If I'm changing angles or something I'll use sandpaper or coarse diamond stone to do the initial rough angle. I use norton and like them, not sure if shapton is better or not.
 
Wow! All great responses. I love getting actual feedback on a forum. :thumb:

Thanks to all for the Narex chisel suggestions; they helped confirm what I had been thinking about them. I will probably go for others once I figure out what I want/need for specific ops.

As to the sharpening, I wouldn't mind either SS or waterstones. I am still leaning toward waterstones, however. I understand why it may seem better for newbie to start with SS and I agree. I think the difference for me is that my background is in a machine shop working with all types of alloys and having to debur by hand while keeping tolerances of +/- .001". I'm fairly confident that I can use the stones without gouging them.

Jeb, your response is pretty darn to close to where I am settling right now. I can work a piece of metal to the shape/dimensions I want, so I think going for the Narex and getting the way I want is a smart beginner choice. I've got a few surface plates already and will be making good use of them. :)

I still need to find some smaller (1/8" & 1/16") chisels, but may end up making my own from tool steel or something since most of the smaller chisels seem to have a premium price tag.

Again, thanks to everyone for being so friendly and helpful! I can see why it is called Family Woodworking. :D
 
For what it's worth Josh. I recently bought an Irwin Marples set. 1/8- to 1" at Rockler. (Christmas gift card:thumb:)I think it was about $60.00 for the set. Someone here said that since Irwin started making Marples the quality was not as good. I went to Lumberjocks review site and read their reviews of them. Pretty glowing reports on how they hold an edge and how easy to sharpen they are. A few big name woodworkers use them. When I got them home they were as dull as a butter knife but after using the workshop 2000 on them and some polishing they are incredibly sharp.
So far they are everything the reviews said :thumb::thumb:
 
What do you want to do?

You have received a lot of good advice, but I will add mine. I think you can start out with a combination of sand paper and waterstones. I am not sure which brand is best, I am happy with my King 800 / 1500 combination stone. I find that I can grind a bevel to a hollow grind, then use the sand paper up the grits to about 600. Finally, I finish with the waterstone at 1500. With a hollow grind, touching up the edge is quick and easy. I think you are smart to go with waterstones right away, but I would suggest working with sand paper to start so you can get a feel for sharp without spending all the money on the waterstones. Once you get it down, go to the stones.

As far a chisels, I think you will find by looking for old stanleys, whitherbys, swans, greenlees and buck brothers, you won't be disappointed. Start by looking for bench chisels, but don't worry about matching them up. Once you have an old set of four or five chisels, you can work on sharpening them and getting a feel. At that point, you can find what works for you and what doesn't. That way you can start purchasing GOOD chisels that you know will work. The LN's are a really good chisel, but at $55. per chisel, they are not cheap.

Here is the deal, I know people say buy quality the first time. Think if this as a practice run. By the old chisels, get good with them. Learn what you like, and what works best for you, THEN start buying quality. I think there is a lot of wisdom in the idea of buying one or two at a time, as you need them. Before you know it, you will have a full set of really good chisels that work will for you.

Just my two cents!
 
I have tried most brands over the years, but I am solidly in the hand forged Japanese chisel camp now, and have not seen anything to change my mind.

I tried my buddys scarysharp. Not so scary.

I use waterstones. I run it up to 6000 with a wet wheel, and then hit it with 8-10-12,000 hand stones.
 
Top