Sapwood? good or bad?

larry merlau

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ok whats your take on sapwood in cherry or walnut where the difference in coloring is significant.. if a board had sapwood on one side but not the other is it a good board in your eyes? what if it has sapwood on both sides..tell me what you think and how you use it or not use it...
 
Larry,
Since most of my WW is turning, I like the sap wood and the contrast in colors... especially in the Cherries and Walnuts... I had a block of Brazilian Cherry that was just over a foot square and about 3 inches thick... the block was almost half/half heart wood to sap wood... I cut it into 3 blocks for pepper mill blanks... the center block was split almost down the middle where the transition from sapwood to heart wood... made a spectacular pepper mill.
 
Larry my self i also like the difference in color. Now if i was doing something for a paying customer, and they said to make it out of cherry or walnut. That would be a different story.Example: We did a set of white oak cabs in NM
(1983).Solid wood boxes, and raised panel doors.Well when she saw them she had a fit.Tryied telling Jerry that he had mixed some red oak in with the white, and she would not except them.They were all natural in color so the finish brought out the different colors of the wood.:huh:
 
yeah its tought to tell some folk that the two oaks are major difference in color:)
where i am leading this is if you or a person and went to a wood store, whats your take on sap wood? do you use it or not and what is ok and what isnt in your opinion..:)
 
It depends on the piece. Some having a blend of color in the wood is :thumb::thumb: Others not so much.:doh:
Does that help?:)
 
To me if I was say to make a kitchen. The styles and rails would be one or the other. I might blend the panels but it would be on a per board type of thing. If I didn't have enough boards to make all the panels with a similar blend than it would be back to straight one or the other.
You will see the "spalted hickroy" cabinets with one style dark and one white. That to me looks terrible. To think they payed extra for this cabinet and the guy making it couldn't even match the wood up in tone.
 
sap adds charactor or flavor to a piece of furniture.

For me, people who are worried about consistant and exact coloring in wood furniture, should just use poplar and spray paint it any color they want.
Mother nature makes the wood in a wide variety of color and grains, and thats good enough for me. I dont have to alter what she took 40 years to make. A reason I love mixing woods on all the furniture I build. But thats me ofcourse.
 
What I look for in wood and finished pieces is simply what pleases my eye. I like the contrast of sapwood on a finished piece. I do try and match it up as close as possible though.

It also depends on the project too I think. I'm starting the flag/display case for my son out of your walnut. Since the parts are only 3 1/3" wide I am trying to avoid the sapwood. However, if it was a larger Piece I would not care.

On the other hand if I was buying a real expensive piece of wood I would probably pick the one with the least amount of sapwood.:dunno:

My explanation is probably as clear as mud. :eek::eek::huh:
 
Larry, I think it's very personal and very subjective. If you're doing paid work for a customer I'd discuss it with them first.

But personally I think the contrast is beautiful. And I respectfully disagree with Chuck above. I think hickory is spectacular. In fact, when I redo my kitchen I want hickory, and I want the kinds of cupboards exactly the way Chuck describes as being hideous. :D
 
I recently went shopping for some walnut. The guy at the mill was showing me some nice dark walnut and told me the price :eek:. He must have seen the shock in my face because he then said well if you want a bargain then he had some with sap wood in it. I took one look at it and thought it was some of the most beautiful wood I had ever seen. Now if I wanted cabinets made I would want the wood to be all one color but for small craft type projects then the mix of colors in the wood is better in my opinion. So I would say yes I like the sapwood in walnut.
 
Larry, I think it's very personal and very subjective. If you're doing paid work for a customer I'd discuss it with them first.

But personally I think the contrast is beautiful. And I respectfully disagree with Chuck above. I think hickory is spectacular. In fact, when I redo my kitchen I want hickory, and I want the kinds of cupboards exactly the way Chuck describes as being hideous. :D

Ah but you are a young woodworker grasshopper.:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
 
I have no problem using sapwood in a project of my own but for a paying customer I will do my best to limit it's exposure. Now if we are going to a wood store to buy wood then I will pick out the boards with the least amount of sapwood. Thats only natural.:wave:
 
well one way to get around the sap wood dilemma is the places we use it,, for instance the one face can be all nice and red or chocolate but the back side can be sappy,, but inside a chest of drawers for instance no one sees in there unless its a wood worker looking to see how they built it,, the outside looks great and thats what is important.. with the supply of wood today in some species diminishing faster than ever,, i feel we should try to use the bad side in areas where its not seen so much and make better use of the resource..this what i try to do..
 
well one way to get around the sap wood dilemma is the places we use it,, for instance the one face can be all nice and red or chocolate but the back side can be sappy,, but inside a chest of drawers for instance no one sees in there unless its a wood worker looking to see how they built it,, the outside looks great and thats what is important.. with the supply of wood today in some species diminishing faster than ever,, i feel we should try to use the bad side in areas where its not seen so much and make better use of the resource..this what i try to do..

Same here Larry. I thought I said that to but I guess I was only thinking it and forgot to type it.:doh:
 
I think that there are other things to bear in mind about sapwood.
If you happen to have a board with sapwood and due to the nature of the project you consider it a "bad" thing you can use it on those areas that will not be seen.
However sapwood is not as hard or mechanically resistant so bear in mind if the pieces are going to be stressed or not in any way.

Another approach is having that sapwood on your board and trying to make the best out of it, to prevent wasting it.

And another one is actually designing a piece that is conceived to have that sapwood in it from the very beggining.

The final results in the second one can be great, but on the third one if thought out carefullyt and without rush can be twice as much outstanding. But that starts in finding the right sapwood pattern for your design.

In other words it is not the same thinking " I have this wood and what I can do with it" than "This is what I want to do and this is the effect I want to get" and search for the right wood to do it.
 
To me if I was say to make a kitchen. The styles and rails would be one or the other. I might blend the panels but it would be on a per board type of thing. If I didn't have enough boards to make all the panels with a similar blend than it would be back to straight one or the other.
You will see the "spalted hickroy" cabinets with one style dark and one white. That to me looks terrible. To think they payed extra for this cabinet and the guy making it couldn't even match the wood up in tone.

I like his answer....

Especially the part about those cheezy hickory cabinets....
 
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