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Sapwood? good or bad?

Tom Baugues said:
I recently went shopping for some walnut. The guy at the mill was showing me some nice dark walnut and told me the price :eek:. He must have seen the shock in my face because he then said well if you want a bargain then he had some with sap wood in it. I took one look at it and thought it was some of the most beautiful wood I had ever seen. Now if I wanted cabinets made I would want the wood to be all one color but for small craft type projects then the mix of colors in the wood is better in my opinion. So I would say yes I like the sapwood in walnut.
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I have done some cabinets using walnut as you have discribed, and it can be done in a pleasing manner, but it takes soooooo... long, and you have to start with about three times the wood that you need to get just the right combinations. And every piece has to be numbered so it goes back to its intended place, in its intended position. I did one that had over 500 parts that had to be machined and kept track of so they could go back to their intended spot. Its a pain in the tush, but that is why the factory cabinets look like crap.


Same thing with Cherry.
Larry has a CD of a carved cherry cabinet I made that was made out of #2 cherry because the owner likes the little defects. I bought three times the wood I needed. On the plus side, it costs 1/3 the money and I ended up with some usable scrap. I can't post pics, sorry.
 
larry merlau said:
hey larry E i can post that pic for you if you like?
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Hi Larry.

I tried a few times, and my computer goes into a convulsion and locks up. I need a new one, but not just now. It locks up any time I try to upload/download too much. And I don't know squat about these things.....

One pic would be nice, might give me a little credibility. Thanks.;)

I agree with you that we have a responsibility to use up the sapwood in places that it works. Wood is not a infinite resource. it is renewable. that does not mean that we do not have to respect the planet. Trees are just like any other crop, and piece of ground can only grow so many and it is depleted.

There is a section up here Larry that was logged fourty years ago, and still does not have a tree over ten feet tall. It just did not have anything left. In their infinite wisdom the DNR clearcut across the road, after seeing what would happen, so there is a desert on both sides now. Brilliant I tell you, just brilliant!
 
Larry Edgerton said:
And every piece has to be numbered so it goes back to its intended place, in its intended position. I did one that had over 500 parts that had to be machined and kept track of so they could go back to their intended spot. Its a pain in the tush, but that is why the factory cabinets look like crap.
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And the really fun thing is that after you mill out all the parts. You put them back in place and realize that half of them don't work together any more because you milled off that little bit that made them work.:doh::doh:
 
i accidentally used a bit of sapwood in the table i entered at the fair last year. i say accidentally because it was supposed to be on the bottom of the top. but, as it turns out, it wound up being an unplanned design feature that i called an artistic streak.
 

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ok dan, now not tryun to be critical,, but what did the judges say about the streak you had in your table top? dont you get a listing of what they do or dont like?
 
Sapwood is a big no no in my shop for either species, unless its supposed to be rustic or some other euphemism.

The backside of a door, or some other unseen place its fine in my book.
 
Chuck Thoits said:
It depends on the piece. Some having a blend of color in the wood is :thumb::thumb: Others not so much.:doh:
Does that help?:)
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Chuck Thoits said:
You will see the "spalted hickroy" cabinets with one [stile] dark and one white. That to me looks terrible. To think they payed extra for this cabinet and the guy making it couldn't even match the wood up in tone.
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I pretty much echo Chuck... :thumb:

I'm not generally that fond of Hickory cabinets, because all the wild grain + sapwood make it VERY obvious where the panels are laminated, and I like that more hidden/subtle.

Sapwood on the back, or the inside, or underside... that's often okay, depending on the piece.

...art
 
Cynthia White said:
Larry E, that cherry cabinet is gorgeous. Is that carved? Inlay? Intarsia?

But I disagree about the cheezy hickory cabinets--even if I am a "young grasshopper woodworker" (Chuck's nickname). I'll post lots of pics of my new cheezy hickory kitchen next year. :rofl:
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It's looking like Cynthia is in for a kitchen build.:thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:
Ask Tom N it takes about......What Tom 2 years to do a kitchen.:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
 
Well don't call Tom he'll take 2 years to get it done.:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
Oh wait maybe you should I hear he can run a grill like nobody's business and the rest of us got to eat.:thumb::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
 
i agree we can go do the work and tom can cook for us,, he was mean to me this wknd ,,,talking off a 5 pound prime rib asking to be ate,, and he didnt save me one bite:)
 
Chuck Thoits said:
Well don't call Tom he'll take 2 years to get it done.:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
Oh wait maybe you should I hear he can run a grill like nobody's business and the rest of us got to eat.:thumb::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
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2 years:rolleyes: OK I will buy that:D:rofl::rofl::rofl:

larry merlau said:
i agree we can go do the work and tom can cook for us,, he was mean to me this wknd ,,,talking off a 5 pound prime rib asking to be ate,, and he didnt save me one bite:)
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Not being mean Larry, just warming up for the BIG (12lb) one when I have you and all who helped with the kitchen over later in the spring:thumb:

And as for sapwood, I have only used it once on a cradle I made for my oldest granddaughter, walnut with sapwood on it and for that I loved it:thumb: for sure it depends on what and for whom you are making it for:)
 
larry merlau said:
or you drop a door made from the special stuff and have no more to match from that board:( but when it comes together its worth it:)
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And the stress builds as you get closer to the end of the job, by that last stick you are about to have a heart attack at every pass!

I made a couple of double sided store fixtures with 14 flat panel drawer fronts on each side, 58 total, that were all made out of one tree. The top panels were cut from the same wide board as the bottom panels, the rails were all consecutive and matched rips from another wide board, and all the styles were bookmatched to the drawer next to it. One mistake and the whole thing was compromised. I was so happy when I got the last part machined and started to put them together.

Larry you have seen it, its in the CD, but it really does not look like much in a picture. The other thing is that only about a dozen people in three years it been in the store ever noticed that all the pieces are consecutive. But it made me and the owner happy. Mostly me.:)

Once in a while I like to do one of those over the top jobs just so I feel like a craftsman, and then go back to making some money.
 
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