acoustics and my garage

allen levine

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new york city burbs
I dont know if Im going to have more problems with code enforcement or not, but I notice a difference in sound by just closing my plastic garage door. a big difference.
I hung 2 sheets 6 inches in front of the overhead door inside and noticed the noise actually sounds less, as if the sheets actually catch or deflect a tiny bit of sound.
I dont want to invest alot of money. I wont invest much.
Im going to hang on a curtain pole inside the garage a heavy tarp or two blocking the overhead door to start.
Might help might not help. Not more than a 20 dollar investment.

Im going to be taking down the lumber rack and the back wall of the garage starting Aug 2 or 3rd when the shed is up.
My point of this thread-Can I just buy some of that pink board or blue boards I see in the borgs and place them inside the open studs in the wall to deflect some sound?
The stuff is cheap, and I dont see why it wont deflect some of the sound back into the garage.
Is there another product anyone knows of that will deflect/soften the sound to the outside of the garage that I can buy cheap and cut quickly and insert between studs?
 
Allen, the pink or blue foam board will help absorb and muffle some of the sound. It's not as effective as the options Chuck mentioned, but it is less expensive.
 
Not sure how this would apply, but for the bigger noise makers, if you can isolate them off the concrete floor, maybe with some kind of foam, and make sure that they aren't directly attached to any walls, will help to prevent the noise and vibrations from migrating through the structure.
 
Back when we attempted making music in my garage, we took the cheap white styrofoam sheets{2" IIRC} and cut them into 2'x 8'strips and taped the joints
back together taping every other side, making it accordion style...easy to store or move. When set up, we left it wavy similar to this> ^^^^^^^^ the
hills & valleys {so to say} help break up the sound waves, also leaving it an inch or so from the studs created a little semi dead air space, which seemed
to help some as well....never got a complaint about the music from next door...although I can't say the same about the hours we kept :rofl:
 
Spray foam (not cheap) but works real good. next would be to insulate with fiberglass and cover the inside with sound board. (some call it duck board)
http://www.acousticalsurfaces.com/echo_eliminator/sound_board.htm?d=0

I looked into some of these acoustical rolls and sheets.
The prices are way too high for me to want to do it.
I dont want to invest 1500 and up dollars and then find out I have to pack up and leave anyway.
Your solution is the best, but even duck board with insulation will run me alot.
Id rather put it towards tools and wood.
Im looking for the cheapest way out to get a little sound muffling. I thought about buying a pair of headphones and using 3 penny nails to secure them to my NN's head.
 
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I thought about buying a pair of headphones and using 3 penny nails to secure them to my NN's head. :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

Allen is your garage insulated at all? If not, that in itself would be a worthy investment just in heating and cooling savings alone. That said, If you have the doors and windows shut and he isnt complaining about the noise I would just do that.
You might think about some 4x8 rigid foam sheets for in front of your garage door but have them do dual purpose. Frame each one and then hinge the panels in such a way as you can reconfigure them as a finish booth when needed. At least they will serve a purpose more than blocking out your neigbors screams :)
 
insulating is one of my considerations.
It will muffle the sound coming out and will serve another purpose.

Rich-I will not ever spray in my garage, even though I purchased a spray gun.
I have a cousin who is a building inspector/code enforcement agent for another city and he told me once they catch you spraying laquer they can really walk in and by law shut you down if you dont have proper ventilation and areas and whatever else all the laws require.
Noise is one thing, breaking codes and laws issued by everyone regarding chemicals, is a whole other ball game.

Im going through woodworking withdrawal.
 
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Allen

I don't know if this will help, but I had 2 issues with my garage door.

One was the heat baking through the door, as well as cold coming through.

Second was the noise level.

I bought 2 sheets of this at the Borg

http://www.homedepot.com/Building-M...splay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

Cut it to size to fit into each panel, with the reflective side facing out. I used 3m spray glue to adhere it. 2 sheets did my 16' door without much waste. At the same time I put up some Garage door molding on both sides and the top. This here.

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc...splay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

These 2 things cut down the noise level, but the added factor was the fact that the garage is cooler in the summer, and warmer (a lot) in the winter months.

Hope this helps
 
Allen you dont necessarily have to be spraying to use that set up for a finishing area. Just the fact you could use it as a partition and enclose it with plastic sheeting just to keep it as a "clean" area when you do any finishing to keep the dust off.
Also, correct me if I am wrong but many of the waterbornes are not considered hazmat like the solvent based products are. Up here in Ma. I have a couple of friends with shops and they said they didnt have to have a dedicated spray booth or permit as long as they were using waterbased non flammable. (Again I am hearing this from the people doing it not from the chemical police)
I spray all the time at my house here but I only use waterborne. All this spring and summer I have actually been spraying outside in plain view of all and had no complaints..... Not that that means much.
Anyway just my 2 cents there. Besides you shouldnt use flammables in the house or garage for finish anyway without the proper safety equipment. And most waterbornes have very low odor and dry quickly so you dont have to shut the shop down for the day to apply them.
 
thanx rich, I know little about spraying.but I understand the phrase adding gasoline to the fire, so for now, Im going to apply finish by hand until I believe things have settle enough. It doesnt matter if I spray waterborne or not, the idiot finds out I get a visit. Im not open to visitors anymore in my garage/shop, so Im keeping a low profile.

Im going to take a look at some insulating boards and that garage door foam today or tomorrow.

I wont start doing anything till I have everything out and down off the walls and that wont happen at least till aug 5th or 6th.

and unfortunately, I still have to finish blacktopping driveway, and then start painting indoors after the contractor does his thing. Im hoping to be quite busy in a few weeks from now.
 
Allen I looked into this issue very seriously when i built my shop not because of the NN but because i wanted to be a good neighbor and reduce any potential noise. I now have a shop despite what my NN claims where the noise i generate and radiate external to my shop is less than the local airconditioners that in the case of one neighbor runs 24/7.

The key with noise is to recognise it is energy which in order to dampen it needs to be absorbed and dissipated to stop its propagation.

When sound hits anything it vibrates it. So the standard practice is to isolate the initial barrier from any adjacent barrier.

Ie the exterior wall of your shop will act as a diaphragm of a large loudspeaker if there is nothing in front of it. Putting insulation in the cavities dampens the energy but does not stop the sound propagating.
The issue to understand is that sound energy is not linear across the audible spectrum it has a logarithmic function. Thus higher frequency noise is usually at a higher amplitude and penetrates easier.

The cheap trick is to fill the cavity with insulation then depending on how much is in the budget or rather what you want to spend.

1) Cover with drywall. If possible place metal furring channels across the studs before mounting the drywall. When you do mount the drywall place caulk beneath the furring channel and mount your drywall to it. But dont have the drywall touch the sides of the walls in the corner. In other words you not going to finish the joint.

The drywall must act as a hanging damper which when the sound hits it it will vibrate and dissipate the sound as heat energy.

2) Before doing as above place a single layer after poly vapor barrier over the wall as normal finish. Then put a second layer over that you can use the furing again or use the expensive green caulk that i did which forms a goop like snot between the two drywall layers. In this case the goop is what vibrates and dissipates the sound energy.

But all this is wasted if there are holes in your shop. By holes i mean gaps such as the garage door so like many things this needs to be a total strategy or dont waste your money. High frequency which is where our issues as woodworkers comes in, navigates well through gaps.

You can evaluate the cost of the sound board Chuck referred to but i found up here drywall was cheapest. I used 5/8 which is also fire retardent so that was an added benefit to me.

I can tell you it made a huge impact on my town when they saw the extent i had gone to and how prepared i was for fire etc. So it was not wasted. My NN problems stem more from resentment as to the buildings existence and their percieved intention for it as opposed to the actual noise level.

Given how the heat affects you and the cold of your shop in winter along with your stated intentions of staying where you are, my advice would be why not given the sheds coming get the shop properly insulated once and for all and be done with it. The benefits and peace of mind with regards to weather and NN's will be more than worth it.

Insulation and drywall aint expensive and the furring channel is just like metal studs available at HD and relatively cheap.

Treat the door as said above and all round you will be a happier woodworker. Just make sure to resolve any electrical desires before you close up your stud bays or you could choose to go surface which is what i would do if i had to repeat my electrical again.

Do yourself a favor go to HD pro desk give them your shop dimensions interior and let them work out the materials and cost then evaluate the proposition.

Heck you got great tools make the environment great to use them it will also add to your safety.
 
I say register a complaint with the noise police every time your nn gets a nose whistle or passes wind, every time he has company and you hear so much as a loud laugh or a radio. He will get the message eventually and skulk back into his hole or the noise police will get fed up and just ignore both of you and then you can go back to woodworking un molested :rofl::D
 
rich,as far as I know, the NN doesnt have parties or anyone over.
He might, but I never see it.

Rob, I understand the value of insulation. My shop is usuable with comfort 8 months a year. With the AC, add on another month.
Its not the end of the world for me not to be able to use the shop in the dead 4 -8 weeks of winter and on 95 degree days.
I did nothing but close the overhead door and hang a sheet and the noise was dampened tremendously as far as I could tell.
I only want to throw 2-3 hundred into the entire noise dampening/insulation thing.
I have half the floor covered when Im ready to move the machines.
My only real noisy machine is the planer and sometimes the jointer or TS will come next, but the planer is the worst noise maker by far.(router is bad, but its usually a quick run through and then Im done, where as the planer could be on for hours at a time)
My wife and I discussed an hour ago when she was home for lunch, and shes totally against any of it unless I feel I need to do it for my comfort.(she says I need to be out of there anyway sometimes) She doesnt want me to give in to the moron or the morons running things over here.
Ill investigate the cost, and go on from there.
 
Allen i hear ya and your NN must be a relative of my NN :rofl::rofl: This is why these people bug us they have nothing better to do.;)
My missus is just like yours. In all the years i have known her and its now getting close to 21 I have never ever seen her get as mad and react as she did to NN about a month or two ago. I thought wow I better be careful i dont want to get on that side of her ever. I think if we had a large type guard dog the dog would have run for cover seeing her react.:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Best of luck with the dampening what ever you decide to do. ;)
 
I have to see just what green dollars this is all going to be.
This is certainly not a priority for me.
Im not looking to soundproof the noise leaving my garage, Im just looking to make it less of a concern for any other neighbor now that something has been noted.
I believe just closing the overhead door has made the local village happy.
Before I hang some heavy shipping blankets I think Richs idea of hinging a few pink boards will serve well as both a sound barrier and like he said, in the future I could take my chances and spray some water based stuff.
The garage door insulation kit will go in regardless as I feel that is the biggest area of cold air getting in during winter and cold air leaving during summer.
 
Insulation is good, does both the sound dampening and heating/cooling. Drywall is also good, ultimately that's why I went with drywall in my shop instead of other surfaces, I wanted to make it quieter outside. Like rob, my shop air conditioner makes as much noise as my dust collector and planer together outside the shop. I think I have R13 fiberglass in the walls with sheetrock, standard insulated garage door with I'd guess 1-1/2" foam panels, R30 fiberglass in the ceiling with sheetrock. As a bonus my window unit AC has no problems keeping the shop in the mid 70's when it's 99 outside. It doesn't keep up with the 3hp DC and 3hp planer going at once, but it cools down quickly enough after I turn them off.

A spiral head induction motor planer also is a lot quieter. I love my grizzly, significantly quieter than my old ryobi planer, and much better results. Also takes a heavier cut so you don't have to plane as much.

I think some pink foam and door insulation kit will be well worth it from sound and heating/cooling insulation. No clue how it stacks up against the fiberglass stuff, but it's going to help some in both areas.
 
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I walked over to a local home contractor who lives on my block.
He suggested I get the non fiberglass batting that comes with tack on strip.
He doesnt see why the paper backing would be a problem if Im not willing to spend money on sheetrock and install it.
He also said it pushes in between the studs, isnt expensive, and he has tons of clips that bend to hold it in place between the roof studs and I shouldnt buy any, hes had them for years.
I dont want to use fibreglass.
I need to do the one wall first, as once I pile all the wood back, I wont have access to it anymore.
The rest can wait till its cooler out and more comfortable to work out there.
 
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