Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 18

Thread: "Rant" I just don't understand

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    NH
    Posts
    4,003

    "Rant" I just don't understand

    Ok from the top we bid a kitchen at the start it was to be built from scratch. Ya know a nice custom job. Well in the design proses the owner finds a "custom kitchen" company and well that ended the build. So this past week we did the install. Here is the proof.
    Pic one the hardware
    pic 2 the basic box don't worry no fasteners where harmed in the gluing of this box
    pic 3 the back corner of the box
    pic 4 the front corner
    pic 5 the second cabinet yes that is a gap in the floor they couldn't be bothered to say like datto the bottoms in or any thing.
    Oh and this box was a good 1/4" out of square when we got it but ta least the glue they use to hold it to gather is weak a copula of good smacks with the hammer and it fell apart so we could fix it.
    Pic 6 they are big on up selling the dove tail boxes
    pic 7 1 and 2 installed.
    Pic 8 the rest of the boxes
    pic 9 the rest of the kitchen installed. Notice the bow in the sink base. I guess we count on the counter top to support that.
    This batch of cabinets has under cab lights been that way from the start. So how do we go about that well in this shop they send you a bottom rail to be feild installed to cover the lights. I guess when you have made to order cabinets you can expect them to be ready for the lights that they sold you.
    pic 10 the oven cabinet
    Now take a look at pic 9 right side cabinets they have finished panel ends. This fine custom shop has decided that finished ends will be a panel applied to the box so you have this nice line next to your door on your frame less full over lay doors.
    In the last pic you can see the nice flat plywood frig cab. One would have thought that it would be a panel on the exposed part but well that's not how we do it is the answer we got and to apply one here would look funny with the extra line.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails tn_mass 001.JPG   tn_mass 002.JPG   tn_mass 003.JPG   tn_mass 004.JPG   tn_mass 005.JPG  

    tn_mass 006.JPG   tn_mass 007.JPG   tn_mass 008.JPG   tn_mass 009.JPG   tn_mass 010.JPG  

    Last edited by Chuck Thoits; 02-11-2012 at 02:19 PM.
    It could be worse You could be on fire.
    Stupid hurts.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    NH
    Posts
    4,003
    The last 2
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails tn_mass 011.JPG   tn_mass 012.JPG  
    It could be worse You could be on fire.
    Stupid hurts.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Oak Harbor Washington on Whidbey Island
    Posts
    3,134
    The words come to mind like. Ignorance & expensively...cheap. Or STUPID!!!

    About 1972 my Dad was superintending a deluxe up scale apt/condo complex with all the goodies pool, cabana, fireplaces & all the nice things like air conditioning fancy tile, top quality carpet etc. The people above my Dad had chosen a cabinet maker to build the cabinets. On the day he was to bring in an example of his work my Dad's partner an architect the banker & other higher ups were there to see the fabulous bathroom cabinet.... let me add here that I was working there at the time spring vacation from college as a laborer. Well the cabinet didn't fit wasn't square & hung out in the doorway so the bath door wouldn't open or close. Everyone above Dad basically said you couldn't give it to me, Dad said oh I'd take it, they all looked at him kinda funny & he said I have a fireplace. Then he turned to me & said get this out of here. I took it to balcony & dropped it off it hit the ground & exploded into bunch of pieces. The architect said my Dad had built his house & all the cabinets in it & that they were top quality... guess who was working evenings & weekends for a while. Dad his foreman & me as a go-fore.
    Last edited by Bart Leetch; 02-11-2012 at 03:38 PM.
    "Forget the flat stuff slap something on the spinny thing and lets go, we're burning daylight" Bart Leetch
    "If it ain't round you may be a knuckle dragger""Turners drag their nuckles too, they just do it at a higher RPM"Bart

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Delton, Michigan
    Posts
    17,470
    overlay doors? should they be over the out side edge so you dont see the 3/4" ply staring at you.. just door covering it all up..???
    If in Doubt, Build it Stout!
    One hand washes the other!
    Don't put off today till tomorrow!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    No, not all of SoCal is Los Angeles!
    Posts
    9,076
    I can appreciate the rant having to work with that stuff and try to make it come out decent. This is the same level of quality that "cabinetmakers" have built and installed all over the country. It is a testament to the difference that people hold in the definition of quality. I framed in a sort of tilted wall for a lumber rack in my dad's garage. The quality of the framing on that wall (remembering that I don't do this for a living) exceeds anything that you might find elsewhere in his home. Just an example of differing definitions of quality; what I found "acceptable" for a lumber rack was much better than what the framing crew found "excellent" for the house they built. Whadda ya gonna do?
    Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
    - Arthur C. Clarke

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Southeast Pa
    Posts
    2,019
    It is just another form of outsourcing....and works just as well as most other versions...

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    NH
    Posts
    4,003
    Quote Originally Posted by larry merlau View Post
    overlay doors? should they be over the out side edge so you dont see the 3/4" ply staring at you.. just door covering it all up..???
    The doors do cover up the box. There idea of a finished end cabinet is to slap a panel on it. That's the 3/4" you are seeing looks real sleek and finished does it not.
    One might think if one was to order a cabinet with a finished end that the panel would be built right into the box. Ok so that's how I would expect a custom shop to do the job. If I wanted to see wood past my doors I would not have ordered full overlay doors.
    It could be worse You could be on fire.
    Stupid hurts.

  8. #8
    I'll play the devil's advocate here. The only thing I see wrong is that they didn't use dado's for the joints on the cabinets. We cut ours out on a cnc router and when they come off the router every dado, shelf pin hole, drawer slide mounting hole and the holes for the hinge plates are complete. Just needs to be run thru the edge bander and then assembled with glue, 15 ga. 2" nails and then screwed with 1-1/2" screws.

    To me the applied end panels give the cabinets a clean look from the sides and all of your gaps and reveals are seen from the front. At the custom shop I work at we typicaly make them deeper so that they can be scribed to the wall after install and brought flush with the front of the doors as they are meant to be.

    The next thing I see is no fillers or scribes depending on what you want to call them between the cabinets and the walls. We always allow a minimum of 1" in case the wall isn't plumb or the side walls aren't square to the back wall.

    As for the light rail we also send a loose strip that is applied after the cabinets and end panels are installed. The difference between ours and the ones you did is that we have the doors extend 2" down past the bottom of the cabinets so the light valance is behind the doors.

    You need to remember the people buying this more than likely don't care how it's made as long as the finished product gives them the look they want. I seem to remember a member of this forum telling me this and it's so very true.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    GTA Ontario Canada
    Posts
    12,246
    Sorry to hear of your experience Chuck but i am gonna say you only got yourself to blame. If the customer was in your hands and you did not educate them as to what you could do and why it would be better etc then you lost out to someone who did.
    You have more than enough pics of all the bad experiences you have had to contend with and you have pics of what you can do. It takes more than a quote to get a deal.

    I get real upset when i see this kind of thing happen to guys like you. You deserve the job and i say that simply on having seen pics of how you do things. But the customer is obviously not seeing that a guy that built and framed their home can do a custom kitchen.

    People have been groomed to believe a builder builds a home and a custom kitchen cabinet place does custom kitchens.

    You need to have marketing materials that show your business in one case as a custom builder and in another case as a custom cabinet shop.

    YOu need to show why they should be looking for what you expect to see and why they should be doing business with you. People need to be sold or they gonna buy from the guy that does.

    Man my heart goes out to you having to install others work you know you could do better. Now if you tell the customer it will seem like nothing but sour grapes cause you did not get the job.

    You gotta bridge the gap for the customer so they see you in the two roles or even more if thats appropriate. Education education education. You gotta sell yourself.
    cheers

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    NH
    Posts
    4,003
    Quote Originally Posted by Alan Bienlein View Post
    I'll play the devil's advocate here. The only thing I see wrong is that they didn't use dado's for the joints on the cabinets. We cut ours out on a cnc router and when they come off the router every dado, shelf pin hole, drawer slide mounting hole and the holes for the hinge plates are complete. Just needs to be run thru the edge bander and then assembled with glue, 15 ga. 2" nails and then screwed with 1-1/2" screws.

    To me the applied end panels give the cabinets a clean look from the sides and all of your gaps and reveals are seen from the front. At the custom shop I work at we typicaly make them deeper so that they can be scribed to the wall after install and brought flush with the front of the doors as they are meant to be.

    The next thing I see is no fillers or scribes depending on what you want to call them between the cabinets and the walls. We always allow a minimum of 1" in case the wall isn't plumb or the side walls aren't square to the back wall.

    As for the light rail we also send a loose strip that is applied after the cabinets and end panels are installed. The difference between ours and the ones you did is that we have the doors extend 2" down past the bottom of the cabinets so the light valance is behind the doors.

    You need to remember the people buying this more than likely don't care how it's made as long as the finished product gives them the look they want. I seem to remember a member of this forum telling me this and it's so very true.
    then assembled with glue, 15 ga. 2" nails and then screwed with 1-1/2" screws. For these you have to stop at the glue

    To me the applied end panels give the cabinets a clean look from the sides and all of your gaps and reveals are seen from the front. At the custom shop I work at we typicaly make them deeper so that they can be scribed to the wall after install and brought flush with the front of the doors as they are meant to be. The end panles would give it
    With the full face frame doors you have a door a gap a door a gap and a 3/4" panel very un symmetrical where as if the panle was the side of the box it would go door gap door

    As for the light rail we also send a loose strip that is applied after the cabinets and end panels are installed. The difference between ours and the ones you did is that we have the doors extend 2" down past the bottom of the cabinets so the light valance is behind the doors.
    Seems like a much better way for this to be done

    You need to remember the people buying this more than likely don't care how it's made as long as the finished product gives them the look they want. I seem to remember a member of this forum telling me this and it's so very true.
    Again very true

    Pm me what kind of cabinets your shop makes. And how do I get them
    It could be worse You could be on fire.
    Stupid hurts.

Similar Threads

  1. SIMPLE JIG! turns a "bowl" on "tablesaw"!
    By steve kelly in forum Carving
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 11-01-2015, 03:21 PM
  2. "Crime Doesn't Pay" or "No Good Deed Goes Unpunished" ?
    By hu lowery in forum Off Topic Discussion
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 11-21-2013, 05:57 PM
  3. Thompson "V" Versus "U" Bowl Gouges
    By Mike Turner in forum General Woodturning Q&A
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 06-25-2013, 01:46 AM
  4. Triangle - "Copy" and "Paste"
    By Niki Avrahami in forum Jigs and Fixtures
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 01-12-2008, 09:37 PM
  5. A "GOOD" Customer Service Rant..........
    By Stuart Ablett in forum General Woodworking Q&A
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 04-25-2007, 02:54 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •