Go east young man - Moving?

Rennie Heuer

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Constantine, MI
Horace Greeley might not approve but I am thinking of moving east in a year or two. Southern Michigan is currently our target area, but that is still open for deliberation. Jan and I have been talking about downsizing to about 800 sf for a while now. I have no objections so long as I get a shop, and I'd like to move out of town a little, staying clear of subdivisions and all the rules that go with them. Unfortunately, around here out of city limits means desert and that does not appeal to either of us. Jan still has family in Indiana and I have family in Des Moines (a great grandson on the way), NY and NJ. Seems relocating 1800 miles east might be what we need.

As an added plus, land right now is relatively inexpensive in the areas we are considering and getting out of town is also easy. Things will proceed slowly for now. We have both gone back to work to save up Some additional cash with the hope of having to take out as small a mortgage as possible.

Our plan, so far, is to build new with me doing much of the interior work. This might change, but that's the plan so far.
 
Good luck with your plans, Rennie. Moving to the area you mentioned will allow you to keep an eye on a handful of the fine folks we have on here!!!
 
I hope that everything goes better than "well" with your plans.

As for "family" I don't know what I would do without mine. I'd move anywhere for them. However, they would probably keep the new location a secrete so I couldn't find them. Oh well.

Enjoy,
JimB
 
I hope that everything goes better than "well" with your plans.

As for "family" I don't know what I would do without mine. I'd move anywhere for them. However, they would probably keep the new location a secrete so I couldn't find them. Oh well.

Enjoy,
JimB

Yes, as much as I like being away from some of my family, there are those I'd like to be closer to.
 
Northern Indiana taxes might be cheaper so do your homework on the two states differences so you get the most bang for your bucks both in purchases as well as cost of living for the time you live here (you all move so much, me, have to much junk, they have to bury me here!):eek:
 
Don't forget to consider tax rates. Here in Texas we have no state income tax. Some states have a much higher rate than other states, and some states tax retirement income (I believe some do not). Compared to New York state (where I was raised) state taxes make a huge difference - I would never go back.
 
I have a good friend that lives outside of Marshal Michigan, he really likes it. He is originally from rural Ohio, but he likes Michigan a lot more, the only thing he does not like is that there are no mountains, which means no good winding roads, (he is a motorcycle guy) but all in all he really likes it.

I guess it is east of Battle Creek.

Cheers!
 
Charlie has a good point and to add to that given you thinking of cost reduction for the long term, keep in mind the heating costs in winter for the Northern States. Even firewood costs and while you might cut it yourself now, at some point you going to be paying others to do that. But i think the four seasons are worth that much.

I do believe that with the developments and understanding we have of modern building technology with regards to reduced cost of ownership and running costs, given you wish to build new and build small, you could get monthly costs down incredibly low for two people if you put the right things in upfront. And that would always go well for resale in my opinion. In SA we had this kind of value creation in how much and what quality you put into security. LOL In Canada looks like a kitchen, bathroom and curb appeal do it all.

I could make a great house out of Peters Barn, but not sure it would be an easy sale when time comes to move out. BUt it sure has the space i would like in a home. LOL

Other consideration Rennie is to look into healthcare facilities. Its probably not as big an issue in the US as it is in Canada given the differences in our two systems. But its one of the things on my list when it comes to us moving in two years time. Example where i waited 6 months for my knee operation, in Peter R area that could easily have gone into 15 months of waiting and if he moved 200KM from where he is , it could go down to 12 months.

I know of a guy that lived on his own in the country 45 minutes drive from North Bay and he had a woodworking accident in his shop, cut off his fingers. Had to get himself to hospital. Rest of the story is a disaster but that has more to do with our system than the point of having a plan of action when living in the country in relation to access to medical services.

There is a lot to think about in a move like this, i have been making lists for 3 years now. But for me I dont care about anything as much as getting away from city suburban life. I dont think i could do the mountain man stunt though. LOL
 
Thanks all for the advice. I will miss the mountains too. Ever since I was a kid I wanted to move out west. I am happy I was able to live here for over 20 years. Perhaps it is time for a change.

Rod, we've given much thought, and continue to, to the cost of living there long term. We are trying very hard to stay around 800 sf in hopes of minimizing heating and cooling costs. Of course the construction plays a big part in this a well. Planing on 2x6 exterior walls, low e glass, etc. Wood is a consideration for a back up heat source.

The big question right now is where to put the shop. I admire Larry and Jim DeLaney for having the fortitude to trek out in all kids of weather to get to their detached shops, but don't know if that is the way I want to go. I think attached sounds much more inviting. An over sized garage with about 700 sf devoted to shop space sounds nice, but that is a lot of extra slab and roofing material. Not to mention heating and cooling. A basement shop has a lot of advantages, but some down sides as well. Cheaper to heat and cool, no roof structure, and easy access from the house. Built on a slope you can even have an easy walk out for lumber and large projects. On the flip side, you need to dig deeper for a high ceiling. That also means a longer staircase which eats up a lot of square footage upstairs. You also need to take measures to minimize noise and dust infiltration.

I'm open to hear suggestions! Those of you that have detached shops, what are the pluses and minuses? Basement, same thing. Heck, I have even considered going up over the garage.

Jonathan and Charlie - thanks for bringing that tax issue up. Something I had not gotten to yet. Here's what I found. Income tax in MI is 3.9%, IN is at 3.4%. However, the personal exemption for a married couple is $7,900 and $2,000 respectively, meaning that $5,900 less income is taxed in MI. Also, although social security is exempt in both states, Jan's school pension is only exempt in MI. So,the income tax is a little better in MI. As for property tax, since that is controlled locally we would have to find an area in each state and them compare them side by side.

We have time to take a close look at all of this, the soonest we would move would be in about 12 months. Maybe as long as 20. Any input is welcome!
 
Funny, we are 1 year into a ~6-10 year plan to eventually move out of southern Michigan after our daughter graduates from high school in 2020. Don't know if we'll be able to afford to move until after she's out of college though. LOML says we are buying a condo and at this point a year into being in a slightly smaller house on a much, much smaller property I could probably be convinced. Life is greatly simplified even though I had to give up pretty much all my toys for it.

Basements are pretty common in Michigan. If you build or get lucky, 9' ceilings are becoming more common. An 800sqft ranche would have an 800sqft basement typically. Some of that would be consumed by utilities but there would still be a lot open. Unfortunately the water table on this side of the state is pretty high. Backup sump pumps, alarms, and insurance are a must in my book. Around here Bilco doors to the outside are pretty common on rural houses and even in our subdivision. Modern poured basements are pretty dry and fairly comfortable year round. Maybe a little cold in the winter but not a problem for a shop in my book. Ours stays at a good humidity with a dehumidifier which doesn't have to work too hard. We didn't even have that at our old house. I had a detached shop at the old house and it had pluses and minuses. I chose not to put a shop in the basement at the new house, my only real option, because of the mess and the significantly smaller space I had to work with (and that my family would have had available to them.) I had full utilities except sewer in the old shop so I put in a wifi thermostat and could bump up the heat or AC whenever I wanted to work out there. A coffee pot and fridge meant I could stay out there for hours, at least until I needed to get rid of coffee. On the other hand it was somewhat isolating from whatever my family was doing.

One other thing to know about Michigan is that our auto insurance is supposedly the highest in the country. 15 miles south of me in Ohio...cheapest. Property taxes are pretty cheap though. Old house I think we were up to about 1800/yr in a very rural township. This one is a little higher (can't recall the amount) in a more suburban township.

Southern Michigan is a pretty big area--any idea more specifically where you are considering?
 
Hi Matt,
Thank you for all of the information. I think I have already been talked out of a basement shop by another member of the forum. Moisture problems as well as dust and fumes are certainly a consideration. My current plan is to go with a hybrid design. I am looking at an attached garage that is double deep The shop will occupy the back of the garage. Many of the advantages of being attached as well as the advantages of being detached.

It is a bit upsetting to hear about the high tax rate in Michigan. The area we are currently looking at includes towns like Sturgis, white pigeon, Centerville, three Rivers, etc. I am going to have to look more closely at the tax structure in the counties where those towns reside and see if it would be prohibitive. After all, we are looking to retire not take on additional expenses. Jan wants to be closer to family located in the Elkhart area. We decided against that part of Indiana as it is so open and flat and we wanted something a little more interesting in terrain and some more trees.

Most of the areas we are looking at are outside of town limits. So, utilities include electric and telephone only. Even so, a half bath in the shop is pretty attractive. Without a basement we are left without a safe place should a funnel cloud rear its ugly head. That is a concern of Jan's. I am toying with the idea of making the bath in the shop out of concrete block and reinforced ceiling to act as our safe room.

We are still early in the planning stages so all of this is subject to change.
 
Oops. Missed the part about car insurance. Will check that out with our agent. As for taxes, they are a bit higher than here in idaho. Still researching.
 
A big problem with a part-time garage shop, and why I did not choose that option (3 car garage so in theory I could have) is snow and salt. Every time a car comes in in the winter it is likely tracking in a bunch of moisture and salt. Seems to be about a wash heat-wise as the outside of the car is cold but the engine is warm. Ours seems to stay above freezing most of the time. I keep a squeegee in the garage and push it out as often as possible but if its above freezing in there, its damp. Even the snow blower tracks in a bunch of snow. Consider a partition wall and keep the shop at least somewhat heated full time (I kept my old shop at 42 when I wasn't using it) and it would probably help a lot. Maybe add a dehumidifier. Some strategically placed double doors to to the main garage would give you long outfeed or infeed length when needed. Or even an actual garage door between the two areas.
 
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