staining help needed

Ed Nelson

Member
Messages
1,486
Location
Charlotte, NC
I have a large library built in I am working on and I need some advice on stain application. The unit is maple ply and maple hardwood for the face frames. I have stained a couple pieces of scrap to see how the finish turns out. Both the ply and hardwood are sanded to 150 grit, but the hardwood is several shades lighter than the ply. Obviously I am not getting enough penetration in the hardwood. The ply is about the the shade my clients want. What do I need to do to get the hardwood to the same shade?

I am using General Finishes Antique Cherry oil stain. On a related note, my clients want this unit to be slightly darker, but it is real close. They are wanting to closely match the color of their kitchen cabinets. Can I mix a darker stain to darken the color? What about dye? Letting the stain soak in longer does not help.

Thanks for any help you can give!

Ed
 
sanding schedule

a possible reasoning for the hardwood to not be as dark is the grit you sanded it to, smaller scratches wont hold the pigment as well as coarser ones, you could drop jeff jewitt a line for some help. jist an idea:thumb:
 
You could also thin the stain a little and let it soak in longer. I use Varathane stain and it always soaks in deep without any problem. Maybe it is just the brand of stain? I know that maple does not always take stain evenly from one board to the next.
 
Thanks guys. I have decided to go the dye route. Tried some medium brown Transtint and it seems to be the tone I'm looking for and is very consistent between the hardwood and the ply. I'm going to have my clients take a look and see what they think!
 
Hi Ed,:wave:
Hope the dye works in your favor. I have used aniline dye and am usually pleased with the results. Keep me posted as to your progress. Hope to see some of the "library photos".
Shaz
 
Don't worry Shaz! I'm taking some pics! I'll definitely post when I have something worth showing. The dye seemed to really come out nicely. I taking the samples to my clients tomorrow evening to get their opinion. Was hoping to see them this evening, but that didn't work out. My concern now is time! I have 4 weeks to get this installed and my "real" job is taking me out of town next week!:eek:
 
It's a little late in the day to be asking the question, but if the client wanted a cherry colour why did you make it out of maple?

Surely its better and cheaper in the long run to use a wood as close in natural colour to the required finish, and then 'nudge' it a little using dyes.

I've never stained maple but can only imagine it is a nightmare to get an even colour - the surface can be so hard that no dye is going to penetrate properly, yet in places is much softer.

I'd have used cherry at the outset - but you don't want to hear that!:)

Cheers
Brad
 
Hi Brad, there were a couple factors that went into the decision to use maple. The first being cost. Cherry, both ply and in board form, is significantly more expensive. The second factor is that the piece was going to be stained even if it was cherry.:eek: I know, blasphemy!!!, but that's what the client wants and what the client wants, the client gets.:thumb:

I went with the transtint medium brown and they are very happy with the color. This is the first time I've used dye, but I did get a very uniform tone on both the ply and hw. My personal preference would be to go with a natural finish, but if asked for it is nice to know how the dyes work!

Thanks to all for the suggestions and help! I'll post pics when I get something worth posting!
 
Hi Ed,

That's interesting...

Our Cherry and Maple both come from the USA and are roughly the same price.

Having said that, at two dollars to the pound all American hardwoods are dirt cheap!;)
 
Hi Ed,

That's interesting...

Our Cherry and Maple both come from the USA and are roughly the same price.

Having said that, at two dollars to the pound all American hardwoods are dirt cheap!;)

So what are you guys paying for maple and cherry over there? I paid about $3.60/BF US for the maple and was quoted about $6.20 for cherry (I may have been able to get that down a little). A 4'x8' sheet of maple ply is $62 and the cherry is around $100
 
We buy in cubic feet - not sure what a board foot is...

Currently 1" maple is around £22 ($44) per cubic ft and cherry is £29 ($58)

We tend to use veneered MDF rather than ply and I pay around £28 ($54) for maple and £30 ($60) for cherry. 8x4 sheets.

So cherry is a bit dearer but I would still use it if a reddish colour was required. Alternatively I'd use less than prime quality sycamore to save money.

How do I convert board feet to cubic feet so I can compare?

Cheers
Brad
 
A board foot is 12"x12"x1". I would thing a cubic foot would be 12x12x12? Based on those calculations, maple is running about the same, $3.60 and the cherry is about $4.80.
 
Hi Larry. I haven't done the whole unit yet, but the sample pieces I did came out real nice. I have a cheapo Harbor Freight HVLP (Woodcraft sells the same one!) and it seemed to work fine.

The dye is interesting to work with. When it dries, and it dries real quickly, it is very flat and dull, but a few coats of Arm-R-Seal really made it come out nicely! I'm hoping to start spraying some of the larger pieces this weekend. I would recommend trying some if you are interested, but it seems to work best by spraying it.

As for the amount to use, it is a little trial and error, but I just used the full solution which is whatever the bottle size (2 oz?) is with 2 qts of water.
 
Last edited:
Top