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Thread: ZCI on a sliding compound miter saw?

  1. #1
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    ZCI on a sliding compound miter saw?

    With my kick back using my cheap, but so far dependable, Ryobi miter saw, it got me to thinking about it's eventual replacement (and that it may have moved to the top of the equipment list ). Are any of the SCMS units out there zero clearance insert capable? I need to start doing some more serious research, and saving, but hadn't seen this in my window shopping before. My front runners from the casual search are, in no particular order, Makita 10", Bosch 10", Hitachi 10", and I wasn't happy with the DeWalt 10" I played with, but won't count it out. I grabbed the handle and made the cutting motion. The plastic blade guard took a nice smooth section right off my hand! (no power, static display) So I figure the handle placement and how I intuatively grabbed it, may not be a good match. I really liked the Hitachi setup and the way it felt, again on a static display, but the new design sure kills the reason I built the box bay window on the shop!! Haven't really played much with the Bosch or the Makita yet, but both have their loyal following. Wouldn't rule out the Ridgid completely, but it's not on my radar scope at the moment. Anything else I need to look at? I know Festool is coming out with a new one, but I already know it will be out of range pricewise.
    Thanks for any insights you can give about the XCI capability on these units! Jim.
    Coolmeadow Setters...
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    When Irish Eyes are smiling, they're usually up to something!!
    At a minimum, I'm Pentatoxic...but most likely, I'm a Pentaholic. There seems to be no known cure. Pentatonix, winners of The Sing Off, season 3


  2. #2
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    Jim,

    I have a 12in single bevel CMS from DeWalt. I just replaced the kerf plate with a shop made ZCI from MDF. It did a good job stopping tear out on the bottom of a scrap piece of pine. Unfortunatly I had trear out on the back side of the wood-- the part that rests up against the saw's fence. From my understanding of your kick back incident, this is where zero clearnace would be helpful. I am, as a temporary measure, going to double stick tape a thin (1/4in) sacraficial fence along the saw's fence. This will ineffect create a zero clearance fence. The double stick carpet tape I use is pretty tough stuff, so I'm not worried about it holding. This should both prevent chip out on the back side and prevent kick back like what you experienced.
    We create with our hands in wood what our mind sees in thought.
    Disclosure: Formerly was a part-time sales person & instructor at WoodCraft in Buffalo, NY.
    www.tinyurl.com/thewoodshoppe

  3. #3
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    I use them whenever I can. Grab some 1/4" hardboard or whatever is appropriate. If you're gonna make one, may as well make a few:

    Attachment 9852

    Double tape the original to a bandsawn blank to use as a pattern:

    Attachment 9853

    Use a pattern bit to shape:

    Attachment 9854

    I leave the original on each one long enough to use as a drill guide:

    Attachment 9855

    Here's my worn throat plate and a new one ready for a cut:

    Attachment 9856

    There you go; nice and clean:

    Attachment 9857

    I use one for 90* x 45* bevel cuts but draw the line at compound miters. I just don't do enough of the same compound cut to make it worth it. Others might during a large project.

    For tearout at the rear I make a small bed with a fence. The trick here is to set the depth of cut on your saw so you don't saw the little guy in half on the first cut. This jig is bolted to the original fence through a couple convenient holes in my original fence.

    Attachment 9858

    If you have no holes; clamps or double stick tape will do. This effectivly gives me a ZCI at the bottom and rear of the cut although I use this primaily for small cuts to avoid "launchers". Another "launch" cure is to keep your blade in position once the cut is complete till it is fully stopped.
    Last edited by glenn bradley; 06-17-2007 at 06:01 PM.
    Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
    - Arthur C. Clarke

  4. #4
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    Sean, you read what I failed to type!! Yes, the fence area also, not just the plate. And I know the carpet tape you are talking about. Sticky and tough. Jim.
    Coolmeadow Setters...
    Exclusively Irish!
    Home of Irish Setter Rescue of North Texas
    When Irish Eyes are smiling, they're usually up to something!!
    At a minimum, I'm Pentatoxic...but most likely, I'm a Pentaholic. There seems to be no known cure. Pentatonix, winners of The Sing Off, season 3


  5. #5
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    On my Hitachi CF8B, I've used a ZC insert in the base fever since the saw was new - about 15 years ago. For the past ten or more years, I've been using BB plywood fence faces that slide along the aluminum extrusions (aftermarket) of the 'main' fence. In effect, this also provides a zero-clearance for the fence as well. The plywood inserts are expendable, and do get eaten away as various miter angles are used, but loosening a few bolts and sliding them over to the center again then closes any gap and returns them to "ZC".

    I do this mainly to minimize tearout at the back of cuts, but it also does a very efficient job of preventing kickbacks, or flying short cutoff pieces, too.
    Jim D.

  6. #6
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    Glen,

    A few days ago I just made a master pattern for both my TS insert and CMS insert. I used 3/4in MDF for the master pattern. I can batch cut 3 inserts at a time using this pattern.... So now I have a stack of extras. I dont' need to put any screw holes in the inserts for my TS, but using the CMS origonal inset for a drill guide is a good idea.
    We create with our hands in wood what our mind sees in thought.
    Disclosure: Formerly was a part-time sales person & instructor at WoodCraft in Buffalo, NY.
    www.tinyurl.com/thewoodshoppe

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim DeLaney View Post
    On my Hitachi CF8B, I've used a ZC insert in the base fever since the saw was new - about 15 years ago. For the past ten or more years, I've been using BB plywood fence faces that slide along the aluminum extrusions (aftermarket) of the 'main' fence. In effect, this also provides a zero-clearance for the fence as well. The plywood inserts are expendable, and do get eaten away as various miter angles are used, but loosening a few bolts and sliding them over to the center again then closes any gap and returns them to "ZC".

    I do this mainly to minimize tearout at the back of cuts, but it also does a very efficient job of preventing kickbacks, or flying short cutoff pieces, too.
    Jim, I'd be interested in seeing a few pictures if you have some!!

    Good ideas guys. And thanks for the pictures Glenn. What brand miter saw do you have? I'm guessing a Delta, but I can't tell for sure. Jim.
    Coolmeadow Setters...
    Exclusively Irish!
    Home of Irish Setter Rescue of North Texas
    When Irish Eyes are smiling, they're usually up to something!!
    At a minimum, I'm Pentatoxic...but most likely, I'm a Pentaholic. There seems to be no known cure. Pentatonix, winners of The Sing Off, season 3


  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim O'Dell View Post
    Jim, I'd be interested in seeing a few pictures if you have some!!

    Good ideas guys. And thanks for the pictures Glenn. What brand miter saw do you have? I'm guessing a Delta, but I can't tell for sure. Jim.
    Jim,

    Glen has a DeWalt. I think I have the same one....... the Yellow didn't give it away?
    We create with our hands in wood what our mind sees in thought.
    Disclosure: Formerly was a part-time sales person & instructor at WoodCraft in Buffalo, NY.
    www.tinyurl.com/thewoodshoppe

  9. #9
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    Yeah, Sean's got it. I think we both have the same little DW703. Mine has been a little workhorse. It may be due to it's squat build but everytime I take a few moments to check the stops, etc. for accuracy. . . they're still fine.
    Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
    - Arthur C. Clarke

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim O'Dell View Post
    Jim, I'd be interested in seeing a few pictures if you have some!! ...
    Okay, Here you go. First, a pic of the front:


    Then one of the back - note the tear-out on the plywood:


    And another of the back, showing the full length of the extrusion (ignore the piece of dowel. It's just resting there between cuts...):


    And finally, a shot showing the extrusion's profile, along with a blank (" BB ply) for the base ZCI.


    Hope this helps.
    Jim D.

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