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WANTED! Finish suggestions for my chair.

Toni Ciuraneta

Toni Ciuraneta

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Still having some sanding and line tweaking to do I'm starting to think on how I could finish my chair. I'm evaluating different possibilities.

Clear urethane varnish

Nitrocellulosic lacquer

Tung oil and lacquer coat on top ( Don't know if it makes sense or if it is possible)

Any other suggestion?

As the wood is hard maple I'd like to enhance the grain somehow.

Thanks in advance.
 
Toni, I don't know much about furniture finishes, but an oil finish with lacquer over it (the third option you listed) is one of my favorite finishes for turned wood pieces. I think the oil will give you the grain enhancement you're looking for, and the lacquer gives a clear hard finish over the oil for protection.

I'm sure there are others who will offer suggestions based on more experience than mine. ;)
 
Thanks Vaughn.

I was afraid of having problems of the lacquer not sticking onto the wood due to the oil finish.

How many coats of oil and of lacquer do you give to your pieces?

How long do you let them dry in between coats?
 
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Enhancing the grain on maple is something gunstockers love to do. The main, not so secret 'secret' is nitric acid. Using a dilute solution, you can wipe on and watch the effect. Want more, just do again. It can take time. Most use a very dilute solution to bring out the grain exactly to the point they want. Then it is rinsed with a neutralizing solution to stop the darkening. Sanded and finished. FWIW, on gunstocks, a high quality boiled linseed oil is preferred.
Sometimes, the acid solution will have fine iron filings dissolved in it. That or fine steel wool works. To get really disgusting, some add tobbaco for more color. :eek: It works.
 
Toni Ciuraneta said:
Hi Frank.
What dilution percentage as start would you suggest?
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Tony, knowing how particular you are with what you do, I'm sure this answer will prove unsatisfactory. Ennyhow.....whatever. :rolleyes: Sorry, these gunstockers are as much artists as craftsmen. There are few absolutes. All I can say is very dilute. What I have used, I applied with my bare hands and didn't suffer from it except dark stains that lasted weeks. Do experiment on scrap. One advantage/disadvantage of this method is that the process raises the grain. Rifle stockers will sand down several times to get a perfect. In fact, some use broken glass to scrape the whiskers off. It can be an ardous process, maybe not what you would want to do with furniture. A result shown. I didn't do this one.
 

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I'll make an effort to get my flatwork done during the evenings this week so that I can turn something out of some not-yet-dry soft maple (pretty sure it is from a Red Maple tree) and apply a 1/3 each tung oil, boiled linseed oil and urethane finish (locally-ish made so brand I don't think would help you) to show you.

I do have some before and after finish pics of this on cherry in my threshold thread - not the same as maple, but might be of use to look at.

That rifle stock is beautiful, by the way - is it a Kentucky long rifle in .50 by any chance?
 
Toni

If I recall correctly, that lovely chair has end grain on the front end of the seat and on the top back edge.

I am no finishing expert, but I do think you're going to have some interesting things to think about when applying the finish, you may find that the end grain is a lot darker than the top edge of the seat.

I have read about putting a glue size (half white glue half water) on the grain and letting it dry before you start finishing to slow down the absorption rate but I am no expert!

Hopefully others more knowledgeable than I will chime in here, but at the very least I would suggest doing some test pieces before you touch that chair and ruin a wonderful piece of work.

Here is something I found on the web

http://www.furniturefinishwizard.com/washcoatsolids.htm

The google search I used was "staining end grain"
Jay
 
Mark Kosmowski said:
I'll make an effort to get my flatwork done during the evenings this week so that I can turn something out of some not-yet-dry soft maple (pretty sure it is from a Red Maple tree) and apply a 1/3 each tung oil, boiled linseed oil and urethane finish (locally-ish made so brand I don't think would help you) to show you.

I do have some before and after finish pics of this on cherry in my threshold thread - not the same as maple, but might be of use to look at.

That rifle stock is beautiful, by the way - is it a Kentucky long rifle in .50 by any chance?
Click to expand...

Mark, actually, it is a Revolutionary period transitional rifle. If you note the buttplate, it is more like a shotgun butt than the Kentucky/Pennsylvania hooked butt. The 'transitional' part is that it is the link between the European style Jaeger and later, American 'Golden Age' rifle that we now call the Kentucky, or for purists, the Pennsylvania. This one is a .45 cal. flintlock.
 
Frank Fusco said:
Tony, knowing how particular you are with what you do,
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What do you mean Frank?:huh: Do I have three arms and six legs??:D:rofl: I wasn't aware of that:rofl: Well... :huh:now that you mention it I find it easier to scratch my ear with my sixth hind leg while I'm planing a piece of wood with my third hand while I hold it steady with the other two:rofl::rofl:

Jokes apart, thanks for the pic, it looks gorgeous and I might give it a try on a piece of scrap, the only problem will be to find a place to buy the acid but I'll manage.

When you say it raises the grain, do you mean as if we were lacquering, or more similar to when we sand using a very soft pad, that is, eating away the soft lines of the grain leaving the hard ones portrude?.

Thanks again
 
Toni, what Frank is referring to about "Raising the Grain" is the same as when water based finishes raise the grain with little "Fuzzies" sticking up that have to be sanded after the first finish coat is dry, with a fine grit before going further with the finishing process. (Some even spray a light mist of water over the wood "Before" applying a finish and when dry, sand the fuzzies before applying the first finish coat) The Acid he mentions, will be diluted with water and the water is what causes the grain to raise. It's not really a problem, just an extra step in the finishing process. Even Water based dyes will cause the same thing.

I didn't read the link that Jay provided, so I don't know if this was mentioned in there or not, but when dying or staining end grain, one thing that helps keep the colors even with the rest of the piece, is to sand the end grain with one or two grades FINER grit sandpaper than you use for the final sanding of the rest of the piece.

Good Luck
 
Norman Hitt said:
one thing that helps keep the colors even with the rest of the piece, is to sand the end grain with one or two grades FINER grit sandpaper than you use for the final sanding of the rest of the piece.
Good Luck
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Hi Norman, thanks for the explanation, just a question about this final tip, this end grain sanding with two grades finer grit has to be made before or after applying the finish? I know it may be obvious to somebody else but not to me.
 
Hi Jay.

Thanks for the link provided, I've downloaded it and I will make some trials as well. I do not want to spoil the whole chair on the last steps.

Mark, your threshold looks good:thumb: I hope to be able to obtain similar effects on my chair. Thanks!
 
Toni, sorry for not being more explicit. The sanding with the finer grit is "Before" applying the finish. You just sand the whole piece with say 220 grit, and then sand only the end grain with the next higher grit. This will be sufficient on "MOST" woods, but a few may require going one additional grit finer yet. You should probably try a test stain/finish on two sample pieces to determine whether you need to go to the second finer grit or not.
 
Hi Norman.

Thanks for the additional explanation, there is nothing to be sorry about, although my command of english is quite good, sometimes I prefer to play on the safe side and ask for confirmation on things I'm no so sure I've understood.

I'll try on a scrap and let you my findings.

Thanks again.
 
toni, you say you want to enhance the grain, in what way? dyes will bring out figure but impart color....oils are a love `em or hate `em kinda thing on maple......most will add some amount of color and depending on the board could kinda muddy the grain.....
for a top coat i agree with vaughn..lacquer is really hard to beat. but it too will impart some color....even if you get "water white"
 
Regarding the nitric acid grain raising - given that the concentration will be low enough for someone to not feel the need to wear gloves while handling the stuff, I'm guessing a concentration of 0.1 N or less (in this case, since nitric acid only has one acidic proton, this is the same as 0.1 M). I haven't looked up the solubility of nitric acid in, say, methanol, but I'm guessing that it would be possible to make a methanolic solution of nitric acid (HNO3) of this concentration.

As I recall with my feeble memory, methanol doesn't raise the grain. Is this correct? If so, would this be an idea to try?
 
tod evans said:
toni, you say you want to enhance the grain, in what way?QUOTE]


Hi Tod.
Well, I don't know exactly, let's say that being the first time I use hard maple and I haven't worked with this wood before, my impression is that left raw with no more than a thorough sanding the overall appearance of the piece will be rather "white" and the grain will be difficult to distinguish. Won't it?

I think I don't mind getting a bit of colour, as if for instance I was wetting the wood, the richness of the gunstock showed some posts ago appeals quite a lot to me (maybe because I'm not used to see it) but I don't know how would it look on my chair.

Moreover, the comments of possible problems where the end grain shows commented by Jay reasure me on making some trials before doing anything definite on the chair.

What about just plain lacquer? It is your friend as you stated a few posts ago so maybe you could introduce me;)
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toni,
if you have some scrap sand it down to 120 or so with the grain and shoot some lacquer on it...it`ll add a yellowish amber hue that i don`t find the least bit disstasteful.......with "rock" or "hard" maple adding any kind of colorant is much more finicky than with a more poreous wood so if you decide to add color be sure to do it to scrap first to check the effect....
toning is done by mixing pigments with lacquer and is sprayed onto the work, with practice (lots of it!) you can achieve effects like the starburst you see on guitars...with just a little practice you can achieve the muted grain-even color effect you`ll see on mass produced furniture...finishing is an art unto itself and it all depends on what look you`re going for as to how you approach it.
 
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