Aggravation

[Alan R McDaniel Jr]

So, I made the pastry boards for #1 wife and my 3 DILs. Visiting one of them today I noticed the pastry board out within easy reach, which is good showing it was being used. Upon a perfunctory inspection I noticed that the Walnut end piece was sticking out past the edge of the ash board. Now I looked closer. The ash had shrunk more than 1/8" from both ends and on both sides. Oddly the glue joint did not appear to be broken or separated. That ash has been stickered under cover for over 30 years. Granted it was not in a climate controlled storage, but I did not expect what I saw. When I got home I checked #1 wife's board. Same thing. One other DIL has responded that her's is shrinking also. While I anticipated some movement, I did not expect it to move that much.

I figure I'll wait six months or so and trim and re-glue if required.

Alan

 

[Ryan Mooney]

Wait until mid summer and see if it's still in the same place. It might well be that that's about the expected seasonal movement just due to relative humidity flux (ballpark math shows that as close ish.. with somewhat wild guesses plugged in as to the size of the boards and the variation in the relative humidity where you are).

 

[Vaughn McMillan]

How is the wood grain oriented on the pastry boards? I've run into problems with cutting boards where I had wood grains going in different directions.

 

[Alan R McDaniel Jr]

They are four, flatsawn White Ash boards glued together with wafer supports. The ends are Walnut with the grain running perpendicular to the Ash.

Alan

 

[Charles Lent]

There's your problem. A Cross Grain situation. The ash is becoming narrower with lower Winter Season humidity and the walnut hasn't changed much at all in length. Wait until mid Summer before you decide that you really have a problem and start trimming. By then the ash will be back to the width that it was when you made it, but it could even be wider than the walnut is long, if we have a very humid Summer Season. You need to learn when you have cross grain in your project design and allow for it in some way. I frequently imbed the ends of the piece with the end grain into stopped dados in the adjoining pieces and make the adjoining pieces intentionally longer so the changed width of the board will not show as significantly. (hope I explained that well enough). We have all made a few projects and ended up with this problem back when we first started out. Sometimes your design can be done to allow for this, and then sometimes, like breadboard ends on a cutting board, you just have to accept that it's going to happen. When faced with this, I usually glue only the center few inches of the joint and then use dowels through the pieces with elongated holes in the tongue of the piece that will move, so as to hold the seam between the two tight without preventing the movement.


That's a beautiful project. Don't put the saw to it just yet.

Charley

 

[Ryan Mooney]

That's a beautiful project. Don't put the saw to it just yet.

Yep.

The classic solution is to make the breadboard ends a smidge longer than the other piece is wide and detail the joins so the movement is hidden and it looks intentional.

But hundreds of boards have been made like you made them and survived decades so I'd just wait it out and see how it goes.

 

[Vaughn McMillan]

I concur with Charlie and Ryan. That's a great-looking board, but some movement is going to be expected.

 

[Alan R McDaniel Jr]

Well, I feel a little better about it now. Thanks for the encouragement. If I do any more I'm going to go ahead and use an edge grain approach and perhaps stick with one type of wood. Ash really isn't the best choice for these things, but it's what I have.

It's a little baffling though. I planed the rough RWRL boards in late Nov. and built the boards in December. They were finished with mineral oil and beeswax (several coats). We have had relatively high humidity since then with actually more rain than we've had in months. The humidity is high here more than not. I used a moisture meter on them prior to planing and although I don't remember exactly what the %age was, it was in the acceptable range (6-8) and I "assumed" that the interior of the lumber was dryer than the outside.

The only difference is that the boards were covered (shed) and outside and the finished boards haven't been outside since they were finished. The dryer, warmer inside air could account for the shrinkage.

With that in mind, I wonder if I could build some kind of "tent" with black plastic and a heat lamp to put lumber in for a month or two prior to working it.

Alan

 

[Ryan Mooney]

The dryer, warmer inside air could account for the shrinkage.

Yep, We're in the wettest season by FAR where i am but I have a heck of a time keeping the houseplants from drying out from the house air because of the heater drying it out so much. Everything outside is growing moss, but inside it's close to half as humid as it is in summer when I can open the place up. Different places in the country will, of course, have wildly varying issues in different directions with different seasons depending on how the weather/heating situation is.

With that in mind, I wonder if I could build some kind of "tent" with black plastic and a heat lamp to put lumber in for a month or two prior to working it.

Better imho to just design around some movement. You'll get something like 1/8"-3/16" side-side movement from winter to summer most places with many woods for a piece that size. You can stabiilze with things like pentacryl.. but that's a lot of "stuff" to deal with when you can just make it a "design feature"

 

[Ryan Mooney]

Interesting timing, Lee Valley just posted this today

https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/discover/woodworking/2021/january/how-to-cope-with-wood-movement

 

[Alan R McDaniel Jr]

Looks like an excellent article. I bookmarked it and will read it tomorrow when I'm not falling asleep.

Alan

 

[Vaughn McMillan]

...If I do any more I'm going to go ahead and use an edge grain approach and perhaps stick with one type of wood...

Edge grain vs. face grain won't make a big difference. In the case of the board you showed in the photo, the ash is pointed East-West and the walnut is going North-South. Anytime you have that kind of directions going on, you're likely to see movement, even if it's all the same type of wood. I've also learned (the hard way) to not mix face/side grain with end grain orientation on the same board. I made that mistake on the very first quilt cutting board I made. It cracked badly and the customer returned it a couple of weeks after buying it, so I made a new one for her that was all end grain orientation. The cracked board is now displayed in my kitchen as a reminder not to do that again, lol.