Construction ideas needed.

Jeff Horton

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The Heart of Dixie
I acquired a light weight boat trailer. Not much to look at but I wanted the axle and wheels mainly. I want to build a trailer to haul kayaks on. Simple center posts with arms sticking outwards to mount the boats on.

I never do anything simple though. I want to enclose the trailer. My idea is a simple frame work covered with aircraft nylon. The idea is simple the details are not. I am tossing around ideas for a framework. I want something cheap and lightweight as possible.

I will probably have to weld up a metal frame and put a Pressure Treated plywood floor down so I have a solid base to start with. I am leaning toward doors on the side to make loading the boats easier since the trailer has to be 20' long inside. I am thinking bi-fold doors that fold down and against the trailer. Just a frame with nylon covering.

sketch1.jpg sketch2.jpg sketch3.jpg

These are some sketches. I was thinking of at least covering the corners with plywood to add rigidity to the frame. Maybe a 12" wide. Some ply across the front maybe at the bottom couple of feet. Just enough to make the structure rigid.

Lots more questions than answers. I was thinking 2x2's in the corners and 1" think framing most places. The center of the roof can be supported by the kayak racks. Those will have to be metal.

Tossing around ideas and figured someone might have some input. This may not be worth the trouble of expense. I can build an open trailer very easy. But I love the idea of boats out of site and out of the sun. I could just park the trailer and not have to unload the boats. The trailer would protect them.
 
Jeff,

What about door skin plywood for a sort of roof curving round over the front? Glass the ply in place on the trailer. If you crown the ply roof instead of making it flat, you would get a lot of strength that way with little underlying framework needed. Of course being a boat builder, you know that.

I like your idea for the bifold doors but I'd be inclined to go for more ply and glass instead. More secure and not likely to rip like the fabric would.

Could be sketched out if you want me to do it.
 
Looks like an interesting project. I like the bifold door idea, but it seems you'd want to be sure they had a bulletproof latching system, to prevent them from opening accidentally while you're on the road. Or perhaps make them open up instead of down, and use a gas-filled damper (like on the back hatch of most SUVs) to help lift the doors.

Hey Dave...do you have the Yellow Legal Pad plugin for Sketchup? :p
 
the very last thing i would do is put plywood doors 20` long on a trailer.
i`d suggest a plywood nose and maybe roof, aluminum sq. tubing for all structural members and heavy weight nylon or some sort of cloth for the sides, kinda like the soft sided lumber trucks.
the idea of a plywood kite at 70mph just doesn`t sound like a wise idea to me.
 
Just tossing around ideas. For every idea I come up with, I come up with a reason not to like that idea. As for the nylon covering, this is done in kayaks and it is MUCH tougher than you think. It's hard to put a hole in it even with a screw driver. I was skeptical at first but the more I read and saw I realize it's a lot tougher than you think. It was used for bullet proof vests.

Dave, I was thinking door skins. Since they are out of the weather and covered they would be a good choice. And the price is right! In order the keep the weight down I want to use it just as structural members. I might do the whole roof but I don't think it's necessary. The curve at the front, thats is exactly what I was thinking of using.

Once I get some better ideas of what I want to do I am going to put it in SU. I think it would be a huge advantage even if it was rough just to be able to visualize it and I am sure see some problem I wouldn't till I started to build it.

The doors are my biggest problem. I could load the boats from a back door, but then you don't have access to the front of the boats to tie them down. Short boats would be up inside the trailer and harder to access. So I need side doors. Latches are an issue I have been thinking about a lot too. If I could figure out the doors I am sure I could work out the rest.

EDIT: The doors would not be plywood. They would frames covered with nylon skin to keep weight down. Just like we build kayaks.

fig_2.jpg
fig_1.jpg


I thought about swing up doors, but they need space that I wouldn't always have. Parking lots at boat ramps. Side of the road parking sometimes can be a bit crowded. The idea for the swing down came around because of the small amount of space needed to open of close. Overheads tend to fall on your head but I would prefer it open overhead. I toyed with something like a Model T hood. That would fold over on itself. But the rrailer will be pretty tall and would hard to open and close.

Todd, aluminum frame could work but I don't have any way to weld it and I imagine the price would kill that idea too. So that is why I am leaning toward wood frame. And it's simpler for me to work with.

Oh, I have been thinking about the cloth doors, but I think I would take a lot of straps or tie downs to keep from flapping. It would be hassle to clamp them all down and take away one of the big advantages. Speed it loading and unloading.

The more I look the more I have my doubts but it would be so unique!
 
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Jeff, I think it would be easier to continue the door skin plywood all the way to the back end of the trailer than to transition to fabric.

You might try using Hulls to do the skin layout. It would develop the skin pieces for you. You just have to work upside down
 
What if the doors slid in on the bottom & had a lock on top & were in one piece. When you need to load or unload unlock at the top to swing down & out lift & set out of the way. You said that you'll make them light weight so I don't see any reason to make it complicated.
 
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That is a about as good an idea as any I have come up with Bart.

Last night I had to walk out to my truck for something and I realized I am talking about a door as long as my truck or close. That really put it in perspective. Even if the doors only weight 10 lbs and I don't think that is figure is out of line. It's still a huge door to have to handle. It's going to have some flex in it. So handling them even in a slight breeze would be challenging.

I am really starting to have second thoughts on this. The doors need to be much smaller but then can't load the boats.

It's starting to look like an open trailer is much more practical. Unless I can work out the door design.
 
Perhaps you could find a accordian type of door that would slide on a track (top and bottom). Just unlatch on the back and slide forward out of the way? or a roll up type?
 
Perhaps you could find a accordian type of door that would slide on a track (top and bottom). Just unlatch on the back and slide forward out of the way? or a roll up type?

That is the best idea so far IMO...I would think if you use the nylon material it wouldn't be hard to make either. :dunno::huh:
 
That thought crossed my mind while I was on a job today. But I was thinking dividing the door into two sections. Let them fold on themselves and then swing out against the side of the trailer and just bung it off. Simpler than having to deal with tracks and hardware.

Each door could be (3) 3 foot sections. That should be easy enough to handle even in a breeze.
 
I did some work in SketchUp, pretty basic but it helped me get this thing into perspective size wise. It's a darn big trailer! But I can see better what I am up against. Need to do some take-offs and get some idea of the amount of wood this would take.

The bifold door idea just might be do-able. Still not sure if it is worth the effort required to build this though.

tailer1.jpg tailer2.jpg
 
Hi Jeff.

I almost missed this one.

Why not give a thought about the way that you are going to load and unload it?
I mean has the idea of a rear door crossed your mind? You could just haul the trailer backwards to the lake shore and slide the kayaks in and out of the water/trailer with the aid of a ratchet pulley from the other end of the trailer and that would need only to put rubber rollers on the supports.
The door could have hinges on its bottom and turn into a ramp when opened similar to a horse carrying trailer.

Then you could secure the kayaks by their ends by securing one end to the door and tightening with the hauling rope from the other end.

You could even make the supports in such a way that the kayaks are inclined lenghtwise and that will ease the loading and unloading the kayaks.
As a side effect you would get two triangular spaces one on each end for storage of life vests and accesories that coud be reached from the sides.

Side compartments for the rows that could be either back loaded like the kayaks or side loaded so that you could cram in other stuff in between spaces could be also added.

I know that kayaks are somewhat lightweighted but they are difficult to manouevre, that's why we have to lift them always from the center and keep the balance hence the side loading door. But if we think about making thing differently we might find less tiring ways of loading them specially after several hours of rowing.

I do not know if I conveyed the idea clearly, I can send you a skecht if needed. If it sounds too crazy just disregard I just let my mind go.
 
Your conveyed your idea perfectly Toni. I have thought about that but ruled it out pretty quick. The problem is space. I don't always have the room to load/unload that way.

With a truck, trailer and boat unloaded out the back of the trailer your looking at needing 50 to 60 feet of space. We may be unloading in crowded parking lot of on the side of a road where there isn't much space. A trailer it going to take up a lot of space as it is. But adding 12-20 feet for unloading boats is going to make it even worse.

The more I think about this the more I am leaning toward something like this one. With a short storage box gear.

6placesteelbox3.JPG


I love the idea of bring able to store 2 or 3 boats inside the trailer. Just come home, park it and not have to unload it. But this is so much easier to unload than off the top of my truck that it would be huge improvement!
 
Well, that makes true the sentence " The simpler the better" Simple to build, specially if you have welding equipment, protected storage of goods below and easy acces from all sides, what else can one expect?, It rowing for you?
That would take away all the fun wouldn't it?:D
 
I suppose 20 foot wide tambours would be out of the question?

What about lightweight panels of doorskins with wooden frames? They could ride in tracks similar to garage doors. I have an idea for a track arrangement. How high is the trailer box? Wide?
 
Dave, I have about decided this is just not worth the effort or the expense. Been discussing in another forum too and there is just to many issues to work out on this.

One big one is pulling such a big lightweight kite on a windy day! Probably scare the pants of anyone in an adjoining lane.

Someone just posted this photo of their trailer and I am thinking of something similar. Just making it look nicer. The woodworker in me has trouble with construction quality even though I am sure it works just fine!

R2K7_03.jpg


I am thinking a frame and panel construction just to make it look better. :rolleyes:
 
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Aw, c'mon. You know your inner over-engineer is just kicking to get out. :D

I think you're right though. You'll certainly be able to make it look nicer than that picture. Give it a sort of Arts and Crafts look.
 
How about making the storage part look like a really wide and short kayak? Your up for bending, clamping and glueing again aren't you? :D
 
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