Jointer inquiry

allen levine

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new york city burbs
Im getting a grip on a jointer now, understanding the way it straightens a board, how the blades work, etc....

Im not going to bother going for a tabletop model simply because I have no more table space and Im going to have it mobile on its own base, so I might as well buy one that has its own, and purchase the dolly/mobile base.
Im going to rip out some floor to ceiling cabinets, around 6 feet worth, and push the jointer against the wall when not in use, so I have full use of the space.(to park the car)

Ive been reading alot, and seems like most woodworkers, not the pros, have 6-8 inch jointers in their shop.
How do you face joint a board that is more than 8 inches with that?
80% of the rough lumber I bought was 10 inches wide.
Is it worth the money for me to go out and buy a 12 inch jointer, quite a big jump I think.
I cant imagine my needs would be greater than anyone here, and that was one thing Im confused about.
Am I missing something?
 
How do you face joint a board that is more than 8 inches with that?
80% of the rough lumber I bought was 10 inches wide.
Is it worth the money for me to go out and buy a 12 inch jointer, quite a big jump I think.
I cant imagine my needs would be greater than anyone here, and that was one thing Im confused about.
Am I missing something?

You don't.
You're not missing anything.

For stock wider than your jointer you can either rip your boards down to fit your jointer, or you can learn to use a #7/8 hand plane, or you can use a sled to "joint" the board with your planer, or you can be picky about your wood and just run it through the planer.

Or you can save and save and buy a wide jointer (or combination jointer/planer)

...art
 
There is a method that allows you do that. I just don't remember the details of how you do it. But it is possible.

The guys on woodnet have posted it several times. I just never pay attention.
 
Im not going to bother going for a tabletop model simply because I have no more table space and Im going to have it mobile on its own base, so I might as well buy one that has its own, and purchase the dolly/mobile base.

You are a wise man who will benefit from the pain of other$, including me ;-)

Im going to rip out some floor to ceiling cabinets, around 6 feet worth, and push the jointer against the wall when not in use, so I have full use of the space.(to park the car)

Your plan is solid. My G0490X stands parallel to my lumber storage wall and moves easily out of the way when I need lumber and goes right back when I am done (felt pen marks on the floor).

Ive been reading alot, and seems like most woodworkers, not the pros, have 6-8 inch jointers in their shop.
How do you face joint a board that is more than 8 inches with that?
80% of the rough lumber I bought was 10 inches wide.

Although I buy lumber wider than 8" I rarely require a part that is wider than 8". You want your parts rough cut to approximate size to reduce the effects of cup, bow, etc. by lessening their span. I just finished face and edge jointing a large number of parts in QSWO; they all fit. On those rare times I need to joint wide, I use this.

Is it worth the money for me to go out and buy a 12 inch jointer, quite a big jump I think. I cant imagine my needs would be greater than anyone here, and that was one thing Im confused about.
Am I missing something?

Alas, only you can answer this one. I worked this over quite a bit as well and went 8". If I had the money I would have gone 12" but mobility becomes a larger (no pun intended) issue. My near 400 lb machine moves easily on my current shop floor. My previous floor would have been a challenge. A 600 lb to 900 lb machine increases this challenge.
 
The lumber you get now days should be ripped down in width to no more than 5" and that is pushing it in most cases. The reason is due to cupping of the boards or panels you are gluing up. The pro shops wont go over 3 1/2" for boards in glue ups to help stabilize the panels. If you get a 12" jointer then you will come up with a lot of 16" board it just seems to work that way. I would save the money and buy a better 8" jointer and if you need something wider than that have it flattened at a pro shop on the big stuff.

Jay
 
allen ,, do you have access to a pro shop or lumber yard that will flatten for you? if so then take alook at how much wood your gonna be going threw that needs to be flattened.. sometimes the use of a tool isnt sufficient to warrant the cost of it.. in my expeiernce i started witha old 6" good tool and i made do with it for some time,, but as i got more into it i realized that a 6" isnt nearly as useful as a 8".. but if you ask tod you dont need a jointer at all.. the new saw blades that are availble will make your glue lines fine...been there done that, its not hip allen they do a good smooth cut.. you can get a good used jointer, but you being alittle new at this you might want get a trust worthy person to look at the used ones for you..maybe that carpenter neighbor you have.. as jeff mentioned you can flatten aboard wider than 8" on a 8" jpinter but its not nearly as good as doing it on a larger jointer.. those that say , the majority of your work is gonna be smaller stuff and to precut are right on the money..on the blotchy cherry box i made i had the door stiles cut out of some wide stock and before i ever planed them, i flattened them waited for a week, and they moved some more. then i finished flattening them.. once you take and break the surface of any board it can move again...so be on the lookout for it.. so to shorten this up, my vote would be a 8" but look at the cost of tooling vrs use...
 
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Now IM really confused.(btw, I bought the Freud Glue line rip blade for the table)

I figured I can go with something in the 6-8 hundred range, I know Ill get use out of it.
Even store bought s4s lumber isnt that straight sometimes. I thought a jointer is a quick solution to this, even if Im building simple stuff like outdoor chairs with screws.
Used equipment is not something Im comfortable with if its over 100 bucks.
I wouldnt know if the machine had 10 hours use or 1000 hours use by looking at the motor and such.(just being upfront about what I know)

Before I was typing that the local tool guy near me sells Jet and Im pretty sure Powermatic jointers.
I've seen Jet on display in his store, along with alot of brands I never heard of. Alot of equipment
Im going to measure the actual width of the machine to see if I can fit it where Id like to.
Id like to get it into the garage before March, so I can play with it a bit, figure it out, and start getting ready for my cabinet build.
Its a bit overwhelming having to make a decision on so many different quality brands, models, sizes.
I dont really know enough about blades, motors, and so on to make a hands on educated decision.
I have to trust what I read and what Im told, as in explanations. I never want to rely on a salesman word, since I never know if theres any other motive behind his push other than my immediate needs.
Ill compare the prices, but would prefer the 8 inch. What woodworker wouldnt want the extra 2 inches?
 
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I'm kicking the tires on the idea of going with a 12" jointer/planer,not so much because I think I need 12" jointer capability all that often but because I'm currently in another never ending battle to condense my tool storage space. Getting rid of my 6" jointer and 12" benchtop planer for one machine has some real appeal. Conventional wisdom says to get a jointer as wide as your bandsaw's resaw capability but a 16" J/P to match my MM16's resaw height just aint in the cards (or budget). No matter what you get, there's always something that wont fit though and Art's handplane option is the only real option (I'd add a scrub plane to his list though). I dealt with a 22" wide pine board that wouldn't fit much of anything I've seen locally machine-wise. Couldn't convince the board owner to rip-it-and-flip-it, so I flattened it the hard way as a favor.
 
If I can fit the jointer under the rear cabinets, Ill have plenty of room when I rip out some of the wall cabinets on the other side to fit a band saw.
I have around 22-30 inches from wall of use, so I think Ill squeeze it in there on a base.(Just have to rip out that work shelf which I don't use anyway)wood stuff 390 (Medium).jpg

Im not a tool junkie, nor know much about any tools.

This is my only plane.(nope, its not a nail file)wood stuff 391 (Medium).jpgI have 2 of them, and I dont have a clue why I even have one.
 
ok allen, no one can tell you what you really need its got be something your comfortable with,, you do need to look at your futur plans and what your space and budget will allow the machine that doug is refering to is like what rennie posted earlier its a combo machine and they are nice machines but you need to be able to set them up for the various operations they dont do botha the same time.. guards and such need to be moved.. so that is something you may not have seen in the pics.. there ar emany options out there blade configurations and brands and sizes... it all enters into the picture.
 
Hey the bigger the better :rolleyes: I have a 6" delta, does most every thing I need. 8" is all the better. They also have longer infeed and outfeed tables which is a plus. If I had the oppertunity to buy again, I would go 8".

Tom
 
(btw, I bought the Freud Glue line rip blade for the table)
Allen
If you haven't used this blade I'd give it back and just get a good combo blade. What they don't tell you is you need a stock feeder to run the board through at about 110'/min to get a glue line cut. I had a 10" and a 14" and nether one would cut a glue line as good as the combo blades. I had a 4 wheel 1hp stock feeder going as fast as it could run (108'/min) and the cut was still not as good as the combo blades. Sorry to tell you all of that.

Also as far as needing a jointer I had a limited production furniture shop for 17 year and never had a jointer that being said I hope to some day get an 8" Powermatic. :thumb:

Jay
 
Hi Allen
I wrestled with this topic as well. Finally I settled on a cost effective suitable compromise for the hobbiest at a fair price and good quality.
I went with a 8" Grizzly. Pitty you did not mention this earlier. Black friday Grizzly had one going for I think $595. I bought the G0656 seen here,
http://www.grizzly.com/products/8-x-72-Jointer-with-Mobile-Base/G0656

came with the mobile base, 4 cutter heads and 3hp motor. When I bought they had it listed with Magnetic Starter and Thermal overload but that is not the case. I would ensure that any machine of this power and type has these features if I were you.

I do not see the additional benefit that Powermatic or Jet provide for the extra dollars. Certainly not for the hobbiest. Check out the Grizzly section I am sure they deliver to your area.
 
Allen
If you haven't used this blade I'd give it back and just get a good combo blade. What they don't tell you is you need a stock feeder to run the board through at about 110'/min to get a glue line cut. I had a 10" and a 14" and nether one would cut a glue line as good as the combo blades. I had a 4 wheel 1hp stock feeder going as fast as it could run (108'/min) and the cut was still not as good as the combo blades. Sorry to tell you all of that...
Instead of the Glue Line blades, I've had great success with the Freud rip blades. (Hand-fed, since I have no feeder.) Haven't tried any of the combo blades, bit I have dedicated rip and crosscut blades.
 
Instead of the Glue Line blades, I've had great success with the Freud rip blades. (Hand-fed, since I have no feeder.) Haven't tried any of the combo blades, bit I have dedicated rip and crosscut blades.

I ALSO use a Freud Rip blade (Full Kerf) and have made many glueups without ever having to use the jointer to get excellent results. I would certainly recommend the 8" jointer Allen, (it saves having to move up from a 6" later).:D I got so tired of having to work Around the limitations of a 6" jointer that when I finally did upgrade, I changed my mind and bypassed the 8" even, and bought a 14" + combination Jointer Planer. (Did I say I have always HATED having to rip nice wide boards just to be able to mill them properly and sure didn't do it many times either, and nearly wore out a Big PC Belt sander flattening rough, twisted, or cupped wood without having to rip them down). :rolleyes: (Physical Wrist Problems limits the amount of time I can use a hand plane).
 
another small problem, I noticed with grizzley, I dont have 220 going into the garage, and at this point, I dont want to invest alot of money in hiring an electrician, since Im about to run another line with 20 amps to run something on another line.
I have to purchase a 120 machine.
 
You can gain a bit on a jointers width by using this simple trick.

First rabbet both sides of the board you want to face joint. You can do this with either a router or your jointer, but the jointer will be more accurate. This will leave you with a bridge in the middle of the board. Remove your fence then joint this high center section down to the depth of the rabbet. Next flip the board over and repeat.

Even if you use a modest sized rabbeting bit that only goes to 3/4 of an inch, you can face joint a 7½ inch board with a 6 inch jointer. A 9½ inch board with a 8 inch jointer, etc, etc, etc...
 
The correct answer is based only on what your woodworking needs are and only you kinow that. Personally I wouldnt settle for less than 8. I have an 8 would love to upgrade. Again do you need bigger depends on what you are wanting to do. People approach woodworking form different disigns, opinions and schools. There is no one answer that is correct for everone.
 
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