pole barn vs. framed construction

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Central (upstate) NY
Some folks have been building a pole barn on my way home from work. Between seeing that everyday and having helped Ned build his shop makes me wonder what the pros and cons are of pole barn vs framed construction, especially for use as a shop where snow load is a concern.

No immediate plans for any building, but am curious as to why you'd pick one or the other.

Thanks!
 
Well Mark, plenty of pole barns here in Northern Indiana. Some fail as all types of buildings do, due generally to age or poor planning/building from the get go, due to snow load or high winds. For me personally, the reason I would build my shop as a pole barn versus a framed building, I can do all of the layout, haul my own fill/gravel in my '48 Ford F6, grade the fill/gravel with my Oliver 770, set the poles and trusses with my amish winch and John Deere 2510, and all of my other tools get the purloins straight and screw on the steel. With a frame construction, would need to hire a backhoe (don't have one yet!) to dig footer, pay for concrete footer, hire a mason and buy block, then could go from there with construction on my own.

Those are just my random thoughts to your questions, will be interesting to see others answers as well. :thumb:
 
I went with pole barn construction due to the cost of putting in footings and a 4 foot frost wall. Code in Michigan now. Then to finish inside I studde in between the pole with 2 * 4's on 16" centers , insulated and covered with 1\2" particleboard.However , when I was halfway done, my neighboe put up a garage and used pole type constuction for his footins, poured the concrete sla , and the put up stud walls. Would have been cheaper than the way I did it.
John
 
I've been wondering what a pole barn is for what seems like years now! Would someone please explain to this ignorant old layman exactly what the difference between a pole barn and the regular frame construction I'm used to is? Is it all built around a main central pole in the middle?

Thanks,

Bill
 
I will try to answer at least part of the question. I have built four pole barns and a baloon framed house.
The pole barn uses wooden poles for the basic frame; usually on 10 or 12 foot center with varying length trusses across. Common today is to use utility poles at the start. I think 20 foot trusses make a nice building. At begining lay out what you want and add at least one fourth; you will use it. Build your pad as high and thick as you can afford; I would prefer to pour concrete now; but it can wait. When I used to use a one sack mixer and wheelbarrow, I waited; if you are going to use a redi-mix, do it now. Then using available lumber frame; I use 24" centered rafters; but where snow is a factor use 16". Rough sawn lumber and used lumber make great construction. I use 2x4 purlins equiset about 28"; again snow maybe a factor. Key in my mind is to use 26 gage U or R panels for sheeting; 29 gage is too lite; and screw them on with wood grip screws from the supplier.

At each stage keep in mind your HACV,plumbing and electrical needs. If it is your first effort go out and look at exisiting buildings. I would see if Morton is building one in your area and go look at it. They do good work, but very pricey.

Try to do it right the first time; but if you screw it up that is okay most mistakes can be fixed. I just spent as much recovering my daughter's horse barn as I did on the original construction in 1982. I pealed all the siding and replaced it with 26 gage R paneling. Keep in mind you can ad to a polebarn very easily.

A polebarn is spidery when the frame is completed; but it is amazing how rigid it becomes when the metal is on. I always found it advantageous to put temporary bracing on the outside during construction and permanent bracing on the inside

Ray Gerdes in Texas where snow is wonder for the kids.
 
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Bill - you know what frame construction is - what houses typically are. The pole barn I see going up is just a few 2 by 4s driven into the ground - maybe at 3' spacing or so (driving by at 55 mph looking at a structure about 100 m off the side of the road isn't quite the same as using a tape measure), and then has a couple long 2 by 4s angled horizontally to keep things straight. They aren't finished yet, so maybe there is more to it for the walls, but I don't think so.
 
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Pole barns are common in this region for low cost farm buildings such as bunker silos, seasonal machinery storage etc. and serve that purpose well. You see them in non-farm use such as riding arenas and private ice rinks too, although CoverAll is making a dent in that market. Pressure-treated 6x6 is the common material for the poles. They are, however, temporary buildings. Lots of crooked, sad-looking examples 20-30 years old around the countryside.
I personally have an aversion to building any kind of permanent structure (other than a fence post) based on wood in the ground. In my opinion, the structures we build should be thought of as part of the long term "public good" and should last several generations and add value to your property.
To me, that means a solid concrete foundation, below frost, situated and graded for good drainage and topped with a properly constructed wood frame or steel building.
FWIW
Peter
 
Mark, my shop is a pole barn. I did it that way for cost reasons. Went up in 2 weeks. Then it took me several months to finish off the shop part of the structure. The building is 24 x 36, the front 20 ' is garage, and the shop is the rear 16 feet, so shop inside is about 15 x 23. I'm very happy with what we did, though I would do some things a bit differently.
 
mark my first one was as well and the garage section was part of that similair to kens idea.. around our parts they have been in existence for many years and yes if you dont maintain them they will come down but so will,,stick built structures..
 
I'd personally opt for a timber post and beam over framing anyday as it's the most efficient way to build. I'm not sure if a pole frame qualifies as the same thing though as I've not seen one.

If you build post and beam, your structure is seperate from your cladding. In terms of energy efficiency it's better because you no longer have bridges between the inner and outer. Post and beam with a sip's skin is about as good as you can get insulation wise.

The other benefit is you're not usually regulated to what you do on the inside. You can put a wall up or take one down wherever you like as they're not structural. If anyone here has been watching the last / current series of TOH you'll see all the benefits I've mentioned.

My 2c's (p's) worth
 
Re: Patrick's post

The company that provided material for the TOH was Bensonwood and they have a nice website. They are in New England.
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In East Texas there is an outfit called Red Suspendors that does good work.

If I wasn't such a klutz I could post pictures of the erection of my post horse barn.

Regardless what kind of structure: bolt-up metal, weld-up metal, wood frame or post barn; visit some building sites and examine construction of walls, roof, etc. Pay attention to the style of insulation; my prefernce is sprayed on foam; it is great in the summer and winter --it works. Each method has advantages in price and ease of uses later. For example my weld-up shop is wonderful with its spray on insulation, concrete floor, but, it is a pain to hang cabinets on the wall. It stand 40 feet from a utility pole horse barn; both buildings are covered w/white R panel Different strokes for different folks.

Ray Gerdes
 
ken what i was refering to is in our parts we have some farms and homesteads as well tha thave let them go if the wind blows off a door it stays off or if the tin gets blown off the roof leaks same with home that arent kept up that is what iwas referring too i have see where the treated poles have rotted off at the top of a concrete floor, exspeacailly if they are in a wet climate or below flood plain. but for most part they are good buildings..
 
David or Steve, you can feel free to mention the name of the company if you think it's info other members might be able to use. ;)
 
David, I hear they are good folks to work for.

The only thing that bothers me about a post building. is rot. My neighbor, built one in 1982, he thinks. He now has posts starting to rot off. Major undertaking getting it fixed. I will say they used to park vehicles in it. Year around, rain, snow, all that moisture. Sure that is what helped the rot get started.
 
Post and beam construction is superior in some aspects. With the right wood choices, the proper preservatives, and of course drainage, I think you would have some serious longevity.

20 years ago my brother wanted a cheap, no frill garage for his car and so my dad used post and beam construction. We took trees and formed up the garage and strapped it with 2x4's and covered the structure with steel roofing. The interesting part was, we just laid trees down as skids and built on top of that.

Its hard to believe that this post is here now, because just yesterday my brother said I could use that old garage as a sheep shed for my growing flock of sheep. I took the bucket of the tractor and hefted up one corner of the garage to see how rotted the skids were. Surprisingly they are very sound. Now I could be wrong, but I think I can hook onto that garage with Big Blue and pull it up to my house and have the entire structure staying together. As I said, its been just resting on spruce skids for 20 years. I was surprised how sound it is. Imagine if we had used hemlock, hackmatack or cedar (or any rot resistant wood).

Post and beam construction excels within houses too because they are bolted together and the frames tend to be on the outside of the house. They are very rigid and if there is a fire, the big round beams tend to deflect fire because there is no sharp edge to catch the flame and burn. At the same time there is a lot of mass to those beams. If you are going for a "green" home, post and beam get another nod because they do not use energy in converting round logs to square beams.
 
I just found a Fine Woodworking article from the early days about using pole construction to build a woodworking shop. (July/August 1981 Number 29.) It goes into detail on how to use poles and wire (#9 tie wire) to build a shop that is cheap and functional. It drew my attention only because I have sheep and need simple, but snow and weather proof structures to protect them.

The author was an apprentice apparently in Japan where they still employed the technique to build scaffolding...again fast and cheap. He describes his shop as being 2400 square feet, build in 2.5 days by 3 men at a cost of 600 bucks for wire and roofing (1976 dollars).

Just thought this might be of interest to people interested in pole construction. Sometimes it amazes me what is in Fine Woodworking Magazines!
 
Mark, my shop is a pole barn. I did it that way for cost reasons. Went up in 2 weeks. Then it took me several months to finish off the shop part of the structure. The building is 24 x 36, the front 20 ' is garage, and the shop is the rear 16 feet, so shop inside is about 15 x 23. I'm very happy with what we did, though I would do some things a bit differently.

Can't say what style my shop is.. it's a framed metal buiding... all the walls are on 24 inch centers, the floor is a special pressed wood that is specially impregnated with a resin or something that just lets water bead up. The floor joist are 4 x 6's that are set on concrete blocks... I have an 18 inch crawl space at one end, the other end is almost ground level. The floor is as level as a table top... the erection crew were good and did a good job. it's 12 x 24 and was a commercial building I bought from a dealer in East Tennessee and I think it would have been fully assembled and ready for me to finish inside in 8-9 hours, but the crew brought wrong roof panels and had to come back next day. It took me about 2 weeks to wire it, panel and put up the work bench around one end.

I like the pole barn construction and there are a number of old barns around the countryside that have been standing many many years. I have an old tobacco barn that's pole barn construction directly across in front of my house... it's at least 80 years old.... would make a grand shop with lots wood storage...
 
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