needing a saw

Frank Fusco

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Mountain Home, Arkansas
I don't do much with Neander tools anymore. But there is always a need for something not powered.
I need a saw, like a backsaw. Have had several over the years but they were always junk. I'm determined to get a decent one.
Two questions:
What is the difference between a 'backsaw' and a 'tenon' saw?
I'll be going to an antique store about 30 miles away that specializes in old tools. Hope to get quality and save some money. Enney brands I should be alert for?
 
Frank, I may be all wrong but, I think a tenon saw is filed rip, for cutting tenons along the grain. A back saw is usually crosscut.

EC Atkins, Disston, Spear & Jackson all good.

Problem with the old saws is condition. If you can file and sharpen, then you're in good shape. It's a skill I've not mastered.

Please post results of your quest. And good luck. Oh also - take a look at the Disstonian Institute.
 
Not an expert, but

I understand the term 'back saw' to apply to a variety of saws. They all have a stiffening rib or back applied on the back of the blade.

Back saws come in different sizes, point per inch, and in cross-cut or rip tooth form.

Some of the different types I've heard about are: tenon, dove tail, and carcass. There are probably a number of others. If you want to learn a lot more, or check in with an expert, check out Chris Schwarz blog on the Popular Woodworking site (http://blog.woodworking-magazine.com/blog).

And now I've gone way over my labor grade qualifications.

Dick
 
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Before buying any antique saw think about how much do you want to spend on it and if you feel yourself cofident enough to bring it back to life.

Good new saws are not ( or so I think) that expensive compared to planes for instance.

Besides some brands like Gramercy tools and Mike Wenzloff sell their saws in kit format as well for about half the price of a finished one.
60-70$ for a saw kit is expensive? the same saw costs finished 130-140$? so:dunno::dunno:
 
I'm planning more like $15.00 to $20.00.
I went to one popular vendor and their saws were $3.99 on sale for $2.99.
Over the years, I have tossed out several of those cheapies. Really, I'm pretty sure this antique shop will have quite a few in my price range. I can make or repair a handle if necessary. And, I can toss in my electro-bath de-ruster tube if needed.
 
I'm planning more like $15.00 to $20.00.
I went to one popular vendor and their saws were $3.99 on sale for $2.99.
Over the years, I have tossed out several of those cheapies. Really, I'm pretty sure this antique shop will have quite a few in my price range. I can make or repair a handle if necessary. And, I can toss in my electro-bath de-ruster tube if needed.

My concern would be more on the sharpening and setting side rather on the rust cleaning and handle repair. How good are you at sharpening saws?

I tried it once and the results were "dissapointing" not to use a word that would break the COC rules.;) I've seen some good dovetail saws at quite cheap prices on ebay (10-15$), Disstons and similars, but my incompetence in sharpening them makes me restrain myself from buying any.
 
If you can learn to pull the saw, the Japanese style saws are great, the blades last and last, and if you do hit a nail, you just replace the blades.

Lots of different places sell them in the US. :D
 
If you can learn to pull the saw, the Japanese style saws are great, the blades last and last, and if you do hit a nail, you just replace the blades.

Lots of different places sell them in the US. :D

I totally agree with Stu. The Japanese saws are amazing. I hung a few of my old saws up when Alex sent me one. It didn't take long to get use to the draw action and I love mine now and can't figure how I ever used my old saws before.
 
My concern would be more on the sharpening and setting side rather on the rust cleaning and handle repair. How good are you at sharpening saws?

I tried it once and the results were "dissapointing" not to use a word that would break the COC rules.;) I've seen some good dovetail saws at quite cheap prices on ebay (10-15$), Disstons and similars, but my incompetence in sharpening them makes me restrain myself from buying any.

I have perfected the technique for saw sharpening. Here is what I do:
I drive to the other end of town, leave them with the disabled guy who does professional sharpening for extra income. Return in a few days, pay him, take saw home. Works every time. ;)
 
I have perfected the technique for saw sharpening. Here is what I do:
I drive to the other end of town, leave them with the disabled guy who does professional sharpening for extra income. Return in a few days, pay him, take saw home. Works every time. ;)

Lucky you that know a place where to have them sharpened:thumb: I doubt I could find any here:(.

Hey! that's an idea, I'll try to find one around here, but good craftsmen are dissapearing here if not gone them all already:(:(:dunno:
 
Lucky you that know a place where to have them sharpened:thumb: I doubt I could find any here:(.

Hey! that's an idea, I'll try to find one around here, but good craftsmen are dissapearing here if not gone them all already:(:(:dunno:

A sharpening shop is needed in every small town. Those who do it here seem to come and go. This fellow has been around several years and isn't very old so I'm hoping I won't have to go searching again.
 
Frank,
when shopping for a used back saw, make sure the blade is flat and straight. A warped blade may not want to flatten out - they're essentially made out of spring steel. Without a straight blade, you'll fight the thing every time you pick it up.
I'd also check that the handle fits tight to the blade. Slop can be difficult to address.
Then, of course, there's the condition/completeness of the handle. It may not be a deal breaker - handles aren't that difficult to make. But, given the choice, i'd choose one with a solid original handle, assuming it fit my hand well. The older (usually pre WWII)handles fit me like a glove. Newer ones are often crudely shaped and badly finished. Those old fruitwood handles are beautiful.
As far a brands go - for early 20th century or older saws, most anything out of Sheffield would have quality steel in it. The other brands already mentioned are great as well.
Have fun with the hunt.
paulh
 
Frank...

I'm not an accomplished handsaw guy, but I'll chuck a few pennies in the opinion pot. I was going to agree with Toni about sharpening, but you seem to have that one solved. So now I'll agree with Stu. I have a backsaw and a couple of Japanese pull saws. Personally I find the pull stroke more natural, with less of a tendency to overdrive the stroke. If your main objection is that you forget, push the saw and buckle the blade, that's just a matter of a little practice...and you're an old dog so learning new tricks is, well, you know. Also, when you're looking down on the blade into the cut there's no "back" to look past with a Japanese saw. But the thing I like best about Japanese pull saws is the blade thickness...or lack of it. They can be thin because you're pulling on them (which is why they buckle on a push), so the kerf is correspondingly thinner. I also think they're easier to keep perpendicular to the cut.

Okay I'm done. Go find your backsaw. Pics please.

Cheers.
 
Frank...

I'm not an accomplished handsaw guy, but I'll chuck a few pennies in the opinion pot. I was going to agree with Toni about sharpening, but you seem to have that one solved. So now I'll agree with Stu. I have a backsaw and a couple of Japanese pull saws. Personally I find the pull stroke more natural, with less of a tendency to overdrive the stroke. If your main objection is that you forget, push the saw and buckle the blade, that's just a matter of a little practice...and you're an old dog so learning new tricks is, well, you know. Also, when you're looking down on the blade into the cut there's no "back" to look past with a Japanese saw. But the thing I like best about Japanese pull saws is the blade thickness...or lack of it. They can be thin because you're pulling on them (which is why they buckle on a push), so the kerf is correspondingly thinner. I also think they're easier to keep perpendicular to the cut.

Okay I'm done. Go find your backsaw. Pics please.

Cheers.

PM sent. Mebbe I'll find time to get out this week.
 
got me a saw today

Shown below is my new/old saw. It is a Disston back saw. Got it from an antique dealer who specializes in old tools. He sure is proud of his tools and I wasn't willing to pay the $65.00 he had on the price tag for this item. I offered $30.00 and he accepted. It is in excellent condition. The handle has no breaks or chips. If anything, the saw has been over cleaned. The teeth are well worn and kinda sorry. My sharpener friend will get it later today. For me, it's going to be a user. My Neanderthal and collecting days are behind me.
 

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Good on ya Frank. Would like to see some pics after it's sharpened, and pics of the first thing you build with it.

At $30 a dozen they would be $2.50 each. Using an inflation calculator on the internet, it tells me that $2.50 in 1928 is equivalent to $30.38 in 2009, and in 1918 it's equivalent to $38.36. Not sure what that has to do with the price of rice, but there ya go.

Cheers.
 
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