Any computer guru's here?

Carol Reed

In Memoriam
Messages
5,533
Location
Coolidge, AZ
My PC desktop died. Age was 5+ years. The local shop is reluctant to build me another because I use four monitors. He doesn't know if another video card plus the video output of the motherboard will work. It did in my old machine. He says he doesn't know and his attitude is that he really doesn't want to find out. He is suggesting a $500 4 port video card. If I didn't like that then I could research a brand box and see if it will support 4 monitors.

I hate being jerked around.

I am willing to research - another source for my next computer!

Any suggestions? Brand box or custom? Source?

OS currently is XP Home SP3. He can replicate that. Or Win7 and conflicts with my old software. Oldest is AutoCAD 12 - DOS version. It runs just fine on XP. He claims it will not run on Win7. Comments?
 
Well, I guess I'm curious what died in the old computer. Typically the power supply or drive goes first, of both which can be replaced. As far as reusing the cards, you can typically disable the on-board video and use one of the others as the primary if there is a conflict with the on-board video.
 
Blue screen of death. Resurrected once. Got documents folder downloaded to the flashdrive. Following day, blue screen again. No resurrection. Working off my notebook so am highly restricted in my work. At least I can reach out and touch someone. :thumb:
 
It would probably be worth trying a new power supply. Blue screen typically is a symptom of power supply problems. The get to the point they aren't outputting enough power to support the hardware.
 
Some of my clients use the following USB video card:
http://www.amazon.com/IOGear-External-Video-Card-GUC2015V/dp/B000NJFJJK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1262206700&sr=8-1

The only known issue is that you won't be able to render videos on that monitor. For normal work and browsing it works fine. I believe you can connect more than one of those to your PC.

Following is the DVI version:
http://www.amazon.com/IOGear-External-Video-Card-GUC2020DW6/dp/B0016B6722/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1262206700&sr=8-2
 
Thanks, Darren. That is a thought. The storm we had a few weeks ago gave it a couple electrical outages as well. That probably didn't help.

I am heading to Phoenix tomorrow and can stop at Fry's Electronics. What do I need to ask for? Or more importantly, what do I need to know before I go?
 
depending on how savy you are,, i would probally play it safe and take the whole box not just the power supply..and possibly have the show you it works before you go back home
 
...I am heading to Phoenix tomorrow and can stop at Fry's Electronics. What do I need to ask for? Or more importantly, what do I need to know before I go?

Your power supply will probably have a label on it saying what wattage it is. Just get something with the same (or higher) wattage and you should be in good shape. Power supply cases are pretty much standardized, so virtually any brand of replacement should fit.

Removing and replacing a power supply is pretty straightforward. I did a quick search on YouTube and found this listing, and some of the listed videos look like they apply to your situation:

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=replacing+a+power+supply&search_type=&aq=f

If it turns out that the power supply was not bad, it's still handy to have a spare on the shelf.

Also, I'd cast some suspicion towards your hard drive. The intermittent (or progressively worsening) BSOD can be a sign your drive is dying. At today's prices, I think I'd also pick up a spare hard drive while at Fry's. Here again, even if the old one is still good, an extra hard drive is seldom a bad thing. ;)
 
to add to vaughns suggestion is to get, unless you have some type of back up software, to save your files so if and when it dies forever you got the important stuff on back up..
 
I'd probably take the whole box, but they aren't that hard to remove either, usually just the 4 screws on the back and unplug all the wires. They probably can even check it to verify that it's faulty before purchasing a new one.
 
+1 on taking the whole box. My Dell PC had a proprietary plug on the power supply that died. Ended up with new PC rather than replacing the Dell PS.

I would not be surprised if old software is not compatible on W7. (Might work in a compatibility mode.):dunno:
 
Thanks, guys. The whole box goes. Its better than a hundred miles one way. Better to have too much with me than not enough. :)

Making a few other stops. May meet Don Baer for lunch as well. :thumb:
And another friend in Mesa as well. :thumb:

About three hundred miles for the day. :doh: If I have to make a trip to the big city I make a day of it! ;)
 
Carol,

I have to ask... ;)

Four monitors? We run a bunch of dual monitor systems at work, even some threes, but four? :huh:

Are they all flat panels? :dunno:

When you go to Fry's, they'll likely have dual output video cards. The PCIe types go for about 50 bucks. You may or may not have two PCIe slots in that old machine. The folks at Fry's can tell you.

I need to say this as well: things have changed a lot in the last five years. The newish drives (SATA) and the newish slots (PCIe) mean that the new cheaper hardware won't work in older machines. But costs have also come waaaay down. I just built a new gaming machine for my son. Got all the components (case, power supply, motherboard, chip, memory, harddrive, dvd, video card) for under three hundred dollars. The people at microcenter were very helpful with their recommendations. As long as you're at it, it's worth thinking about... ;)

Thanks,

Bill

(ps. I'm not recommending this card, just showing you the range: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=4942565&CatId=3670 looks like it would drive two flat panel monitors. If you do get a new power supply, and plan to run multiple cards, make sure you get a properly sized power supply. 250W won't get you where you want to be... ;)
 
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Carol, Just a comment. I had the same experience recently and before taking the box over to my tech friend to revive i opened it up and blew about 10 pounds of dust and cobwebs out. Machine has worked fine ever since.

I have been thinking about getting an older machine just to do my drafting with AutoCAD. I have the 2000 version. I haven't checked into compatibility with newer OS's but it would sure bite to not have it.
 
I don't believe there's any problem with running a video card alongside the onboard video. There's a REALLY easy way to find out for SURE - plug one in. Like the old one. See if you can drive all four monitors from the new box, n'matter what box it is.

I also don't believe the problem was a power supply issue; power supplies tend to lose one of the hots (+5, +12, -12), or allow it to get bad enough to trigger the inhibit line (which blocks ANY voltage from leaving the power supply). In short, power supply issues TEND to yield completely dead computers - not BSDs. A BSD tends to come from a logic failure someplace - the CPU, memory, a controller, that sort of thing.

So... we're down to finding you another off-the-shelf computer, to which you'll add your extra video cards. Dell's pretty much an industry standard, and so's Lenovo. The details will need to be subject to your spec, based on your usage.
 
Looks like I'm actually useful for once! :)

First, your local PC guy is a schmuck. Those $500 video cards are made for rendering the human genome, not filing your taxes. What he's trying to sell you is the equivalent of paying extra for a car dealer to re-chrome your wheels: Shameless upselling.

Anywho, BSODs have a few major causes - software, heat, and power. If you're lucky (and I doubt it in this case), you might just have an issue with your Windows installation - if your computer powers up to the "POST" screen (which on most commercially made machines shows the logo), you might just need to reinstall Windows.

The largest cause of BSODs is, one way or another, heat. Heat causes problems in two ways: If a chip overheats, it won't work properly, and if it's running too hot, it will be slowly damaged over time. If your computer had failed after a few hours of use, I'd suggest that you open it up and blow out the dust bunnies, but a blue screen after being left off for several hours suggests that if heat is the culprit, the damage is permanent.

The final cause is, as mentioned earlier, power. If your power supply were on the fritz, you'd likely not see anything at all or have a crash sometime after boot - if a computer doesn't receive the voltages required to start up, nothing happens. However, in addition to the power supply, there's a whole bunch of power filtering electronics on every part of your computer - motherboard, video card, etc. - and a failure in any of these could cause a crash on startup. It is worth noting that power supplies are very cheap - odds are you can pick up a secondhand ANTEC or Corsair power supply of 400 watts or more for under $30 on eBay.

One thing to check for is whether your computer is booting, but you just can't see it. If you get a blue screen but the windows startup noise still comes through your speakers, it might just be a bad video card - a relatively inexpensive and easy fix.

If you're looking to purchase a replacement computer, the biggest question is what you want to use it for. If you're not doing anything too processor-intensive, your best bet is to buy something very cheap - you can get a fairly good desktop sans monitor for about $250 nowadays - and upgrade it yourself. So long as the computer has a PCI Express 16x and old-school PCI slot (most of them do, though you should check before buying), you can easily add quad monitor support for about $120 more by adding additional video cards like these:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814139038
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814139018

An even better solution would be to use an "SLI" or "Crossfire" motherboard that would allow you to use two standard video cards instead of having to buy a more expensive card for the much older, much slower PCI bus. However, these motherboards are extremely rare on affordable computers, and unless you're willing to build your own system, you won't get a very good price.
 
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