Shed Thread

Messages
2,700
Location
Los Angeles, CA
After looking at Allen's shed and Brent's shed thread I thought it would be nice to have the extra space. I have some space behind the detached garage that I always thought was a waste. I think it would be perfect for a shed. Since I want to build it with a permit, I went down to the LA zoning office to inquire about building a shed. First, I was told that I wouldn't need a permit if it was under a certain size. Though, when I told him that I want to build a lean-to shed (I have attaced a picture sample) which will be attached to the back of the garage, then he said that it is like building an extension and a permit will be required.

I am thinking of building a door on the back wall of the garage, so I could enter the garage thru the shed.

I have attached the aerial image of the house which shows the garage (brown roof) and the space behind it. I have also attached some pics of the space. The distance between the garage and the rear property line is 12.5 ft and the length of the garage is 17.4 ft. I would like to build a shed that is either 8 x14 or 8 x 12 ft. The ground is concrete.

Is this something that a total construction novice can do himself?

Do I need to have the framed floor bolted to the concrete floor or patio stones or cinder blocks are needed? or attaching the shed to the garage is enough?

What kind of equipment will be needed to do this?

Any and all ideas and suggestions are welcomed.
 

Attachments

  • House.jpg
    House.jpg
    39.2 KB · Views: 82
  • Lean to shed.jpg
    Lean to shed.jpg
    66.2 KB · Views: 77
  • IMG_1539.jpg
    IMG_1539.jpg
    61 KB · Views: 73
  • IMG_1540.jpg
    IMG_1540.jpg
    64.8 KB · Views: 69
  • IMG_1541.jpg
    IMG_1541.jpg
    36.8 KB · Views: 70
  • IMG_1542.jpg
    IMG_1542.jpg
    40.1 KB · Views: 64
build the seperate shed and never invite a code inspector to visit you to check your permit approved shed. Never.
Dont play with hornets nests.

build it and post some pictures.
 
I think you could certainly tackle a lean to like that.

Framing in a door might be a little more challenging, but possible.

Allens method is much faster than mine :D

But I'm enjoying mine, even if it is much slower paced... :thumb:
 
I would agree with the no inspector visit build. So I think I would build it like a yard barn on 4x4 runners so it is up off of the concrete (use treated 4x4's) then you will have less moisture to deal with. You don't say what you will be using the shed for. You could still wire it and with underground wire or a slightly concealed piece of conduit/plastic conduit, a link from your home could supply electric to it.
Tools, on the basic side, a circular saw, hammer, nails, screwdriver for screws on hinges. A sliding compound miter saw would be handy like an air nailer would, but not necessary.
Keep asking questions, I want to see a third shed build.
 
Just a different view of things but if you got budget why not extend the garage out to the furtherest you can go backwards.

This would give you a much larger space and perhaps use of the garage for a car as opposed to shop or moving the shop setup each time you want to get a car in.

In my view this would depend on what duration you plan on being in the location and budget.

Otherwise i would go stand alone shed at the very least it could be possible to make it moveable. And in that case its very doable for a guy with your demonstrated abilities and all the help you can get from this place. :D

Mohammad I built a lean to shed on the side of my house but that was definitely because of the narrow passage and length of the corridor.

Looking at your area looks like you already have concrete down, dont know how thick but looks good enough to take a shed. I would just raise it off the concrete for the sake of rain.


Check this picture out for what i mean on the base

There are small concrete deckblocks available at HD they have a cross cut out on top that will fit the standard 2x lumber as well as a center opening for 4x4 lumber posts.

What i did was to get 4 of them. Then build a pressure treated wood frame across the top to create a base for the floor of my shed the dimension of the shed i wanted.

Then i put down some plywood and i think i only used 5/8 and then built a frame up from there all around. Get a decent battery operated impact drill or hire one and screw the whole thing together. If you have one use the mitre saw or even a circular saw and cut the lumber for framing. It can all be 2x lumber. Then all you do is wrap the shed from the outside of the frame with whatever you fancy.

You could do board and battern which is placing a wide pine board and lapping the joint. But i would think that may cost more than the already grooved plywood they have for this purpose. It comes in standard 4x8 sheets so if you make your wall height to match you can get away without even cutting the plywood.

Where you are i doubt you have to worry about snow loads and looking at the height of your garage you dont appear to be going to have a problem with shed height. In which case you may want to think through how to use the roof area and what type of roof to put on it. Thats a great deal of storage space if you think it through and put something like a mini gambrel truss configuration on it. They also pretty easy to build and you would build them on the ground. In fact you may want to consider using the concrete as a work surface before you even start and make up some of the trusses while you can lie the lumber flat on the concrete.

Take a look here in the Google sketchup warehouse and you will get an idea of what i mean

If you download the free sketchup program from google and then go to the warehouse you can download most of these models and play around with them and modify them.

But my point about being able to build it diy is if you use the rafter area under a gambrel type roof there is at least i would say perhaps 3 ft high by half the width of the shed storage space above the wall height and it wont affect the roof structure strength. Do as i did and put a small door in that area on the face and you can access it from outside which will be great if you wish to store lengths of anything or if you put a plywood ceiling in the shed you can even store other junk we all have up there.

Then of course you only got to put plywood on the roof and shingle it.

My guestimate is you are in for i would say around $800 to $1000 by the time you done doing it as i suggested. You do not need to use pressure treated wood all around the framing. I would just do it on the floor frame.

Take a look at these pictures this is what i built on the side of the house.

http://familywoodworking.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=27838&d=1232077562

http://familywoodworking.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=27837&d=1232077494

http://familywoodworking.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=27836&d=1232077494

I did not really make a plan i just used a book on sheds as guidance for what i wanted. You will see i used pressure treated for the frames but in hindsite i did not need to.

Well hope you have some ideas now.:D
 
I'm also in the "build a separate structure" choir. I think ultimately the costs will be a bit less (even though you'd be building an extra wall), and you could still build a couple of pass-through doors to go straight from the garage to the shed. But I do also see the advantages to making it a proper (and permitted) extension to the garage.

To answer your questions:

Is this something that a total construction novice can do himself?

With a bit of help and guidance from here and other resources, sure.

Do I need to have the framed floor bolted to the concrete floor or patio stones or cinder blocks are needed? or attaching the shed to the garage is enough?

Personally, I'd bolt the frame to the slab. It's easy to do...you'd be amazed how easily concrete drills with a hammer drill. And there are various expansion bolts made just for attaching things to concrete. I'd also be inclined to just use the slab as the floor, as long as it slopes and drains away from the garage now.

What kind of equipment will be needed to do this?

Hammer, nails, saw, square, level, chalkline, ladder, and string. Other things will make it easier, but it can be done with very few tools and very little technology. I've got pretty much all that stuff (and more) that you're more than welcome to borrow. (You'd have to buy your own nails, though.) :p I've got a compound miter saw and hammer drill, too. I'd also be glad to help you put it up. Something like this can be built solo, but there are a number of tasks that go faster (and more safely) with two or more people's strength. With things already planned out pretty well, it's conceivable that two hacks like us could frame and skin a shed this size in a weekend.
 
i vote seperate shed like the rest have said you could check on the permitted version of connecting building but i am pretty sure you wont like the cost of the paper work ..and if vaughn has agreed to give youa hand go forit and use his advice and experience he does know more than spinny stuff:)
 
Build the separate no-permit-needed shed!

You're in L.A. Earthquake country! If you attach it to the garage, it'll be seen by the inspectors as part of the building, and will have to meet quake standards, so you'll likely end up having to bust up that existing slab to pour a steel reinforced one, with perimeter footers for the shed.

You'll also have to embed bolts in the new slab to bolt the new addition down.

The corners of the new addition (shed) will have to be built as shear-walls, and other quake-resistant structural items -like rafter clips, etc. - will have to be added. Worst case situation: you may have to retrofit the garage the shed is attached to, to bring it up to code as well.

Cost! Hassle! Many inspections!

Take the easy, and less expensive, way out and just build a standalone.

Also, it you don't want to build it yourself, check out "Tuff Shed." They're very well built, and they go up in a few hours - very similar to Allen's.
 
mohammed, I built a small 3x5 shed myself in less than 10 hours.
I simply walked into my 6x6 shed and copied the design exactly.
I adjusted the roof for a better pitch, but thats easy enough.
If you invite the devil in, hes going to be checking all these things, like pitch, building codes, and he will find something.
Code inspectors and their superiority complexes are something I discovered most people want to avoid.
Listen to Jim, he knows what hes talking about.
I dont know if 84 lumber is near you, but they are having great sales on sheds right now.
 
Also check with zoning office on setback requirements for auxiliary structures. In my area sheds must be 10' from side or rear property line. They also can't be closer than 10' from the main structure. You can easily find this info on-line by going to the county web site. My next door neighbor built a shed without getting the required permit. The county uses aerial photography to detect changes and he got busted and fined. It's best if you make an attempt to honor the ordinance and get the planners to help sort out what you can and can't do.
 
Thanks all for the suggestions and comments.

Jonathon, I want to put some of the large and noisy tools in the shed. These tools can be out of sight but should also be in the range of a remote control. I have already bought one such tool. It is a dust collector (stealth gloat). Another that I can think of is a compressor. Of course I am going to need power and also some way of linking the pipes and ductwork from the tools in the shed to the tools in the garage. I am not even sure if you can do that legally. This was the main reason why I was thinking of an attached shed.

John, I am not sure what a lattice walled passage is but I will look that up.

Thanks Rob, for taking the time out to post the links and provide ideas like over-head storage. The garage will never be used to park cars. I told my wife that the house is yours but the garage is mine.

I have a compound (non-sliding) miter saw (stealth gloat). Thanks Vaughn for offering tools as well as physical help. I may need both. I was going to buy a book on building a shed but a kind family member has offered to send me his book, free of charge. How could I refuse. I think you guys have a pretty good idea who I am talking about.

Jim, I didn't think about the earthquake safety standards. Solid reason to build a detached shed.

Ted, this was the reason why I went down to the zoning office. The guy who I spoke with was pretty sure that I could build a shed in that space. I think I will go down there once more and re-confirm this and also ask some other questions.

I know that I sneaked in some stealth gloats above. I will try to post pics later. You guys know how bad I am with posting pics.
 
If you are considering running any type of electrical lines or piping into the shed, thats an entirely new ballgame.
And thats another thing, if you do run electrical and run machines out of that shed, you may be opening up a can of worms.
A storage shed is one thing. A building with electrical lines running into it needs to meet all kind of standards and youre going to have inspections for electrical and anything you run into there.
I say avoid all the aggrevation and build a storage shed, put all your machines on wheels, and move them in and out of the garage/shop as you need them.
Neighbors attitudes change quickly and often.
I just know people. And when it comes to where they live, the new guy on the block shouldnt make waves.
 
Last edited:
Allen, around here, I'm not sure it's necessary to get electrical inspections for things like sheds. (The code enforcement guys will be able to say for sure.) I know we've got a free-standing shed with power, and I don't think the previous owner was required to get it inspected. (I'd be using it as my DC and compressor room I'd it wasn't already full of household junk.)

Mohammad, I don't think running DC ducts or air pipelines between a shed and the shop will be an issue, but here again, the guys downtown will be able to tell you for certain. I can also help with things like wiring if need be. ;)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
man mohammad just give him the reins and tell gee and haw and you wil have this shed before the sun comes up for the fall solitice:) he already got his head around it and i am sure he thinking on what size wire you need to run to tget he proper juice to the stuff that going in there:rofl::rofl::thumb:

you have a project manager and a laborer all in one.. grab him quick and get him to sign on the dotted line so he cant back out:) but feed and water him regular we need him here to:)
 
mohammed, whatever you decide to do, I wish you luck, and look foward to seeing the build, and the new space in the shop.
I believe when it comes to woodworking, no matter what type of woodworking you enjoy, clamps and shop space can always be increased.
 
Mohammad, I would seize upon Vaughns offer with both hands and feet. There is not a doubt in my body that he would be an incredible asset to have around.:thumb: Great offer Vaughn.:thumb::thumb::thumb:
 
Today, I paid another visit to the zoning people down at the LA building department. I spoke with a zoning guy and a building engineer.

The zoning guy told me that I don't need a setback behind the garage because the garage is a single storey structure. He also said that I will have no trouble getting the permit as long as the combined area of all the structures is less than 50 percent of the total lot size. He did notice an easement (overhead power line in the back) and said that I will need an authorization from the department of water & power.

He said that I won't need a permit if the shed is 64 sq ft or less but it will be needed if I run power into the shed. When I told him that I may run compressor pipelines and ductwork from the shed to the garage, he said that a combined electrical/plumbing permit may be required.

I asked the building engineer about a building a pass-thru door on the back wall of the garage and he said that this might make the whole thing complicated as far as the permit is concerned. I am thinking of abandoning that idea for now.

I asked him about raising the wood-framed floor by putting stone blocks underneath and he said that I could bolt it directly to the concrete floor using expansion bolts.

I was told that since it is a simple structure, I could draw out the plans myself and most probably they won't require an engineer to draw the plans.
 
Top