Dust collection thoughts

Jeff Horton

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The Heart of Dixie
I need dust collection really bad. I have a lot of sinus problems and I know some of mine are dust related. Money is tight, work is slow so buying what I want is not an option.

One of the best ways is skipping the filters and just to dump the chips outside the shop and that takes the fine dust with it rather than keeping it airborne. (Yes it take out the heated or cooled air too.) I live in an area where that is an option. If I had a blower I could build something outside to catch the chips where I could haul them off. No need for filters and cleaner air.

Which begs the question; where do I find a blower? Pentz web site has all the info on building one but if I could find a used blower, it would cheaper since I don't have any of the parts and I am all about cheaper.

Any suggestions?
 
What size are you looking for? If you have 3 phase power or a converter, you might find one from an industrial salvage yard, or used equipment dealer online. A 2-5hp 220v fan will be hard to find I think. Lots of 1.5hp 110v blowers out there for contractors/ventilation, and lot of industrial ones 3phase 5+hp.
 
Jeff, How many machines are you planning to run at a time?

In my little shop I had all the major chip makers Table-saw, Jointer, 2 Planers portable & floor model, SCMS, RAS & combo sander. All hooked up to a 2 HP Grizzly DC.

I didn't hook up the Shapers, Band-saws or Scroll-saw or the Spindle-sander, Mortiser, Drill-presses or Lathes. The router tables were hooked up to shop-vac's.
I imagine I will hook up some more machines in the next shop but still only the ones that will be used the most.

I've thought about a cyclone & am about where you are in thought of just blowing it out into a shop built dump trailer but now with having an older Bobcat with forks I think a box with a hinged top that can be picked up with the Bobcat & hauled out & dumped would be the way to go.

I think if your shop tool situation is close to mine a 2 HP blower should work ok. Keep an eye on Craigslist for a regular 2 HP DC & just use the blower from it .
 
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I need dust collection really bad. I have a lot of sinus problems and I know some of mine are dust related. Money is tight, work is slow so buying what I want is not an option.

One of the best ways is skipping the filters and just to dump the chips outside the shop and that takes the fine dust with it rather than keeping it airborne. (Yes it take out the heated or cooled air too.) I live in an area where that is an option. If I had a blower I could build something outside to catch the chips where I could haul them off. No need for filters and cleaner air.

Which begs the question; where do I find a blower? Pentz web site has all the info on building one but if I could find a used blower, it would cheaper since I don't have any of the parts and I am all about cheaper.

Any suggestions?

You didn't mention it in your post, but are you using a good quality dust mask?

I am in the same situation that you describe and I religiously use a dust mask with the replacable filters whenever I am creating dust or painting. It does wonders for my nose and sinuses. It's a bit uncomfortable at first but now I'm used to it. I wipe it down periodically with denatured alcohol and vacuum the filter ports often.

The dust mask is in addition to a suspended air filter and "shop vacs" hooked to all my dust making tools. Hope this helps.

OBTW, I also use eye protection when I am using power tools too. I get alergies in the eyes too. It keeps the dust and flying wood out of my eyes - which can't hurt.
 
It starts wars on some forums but reading Bill Pentz web site I am thinking I need at least 3 hp to get the amount of air flow to pull out the fine dust that does the damage.

I have been thinking on this and so far I have found one blower from Penn State but it is still $400. Building a Pentz blower is at least $400 unless I just lucked up on used parts.

Now I am thinking that watching Craigslist for a used unit and just using it for the blower. I have a good spot outside that I can put the blower and dust bins.
 
It starts wars on some forums but reading Bill Pentz web site I am thinking I need at least 3 hp to get the amount of air flow to pull out the fine dust that does the damage.

I have been thinking on this and so far I have found one blower from Penn State but it is still $400. Building a Pentz blower is at least $400 unless I just lucked up on used parts.

Now I am thinking that watching Craigslist for a used unit and just using it for the blower. I have a good spot outside that I can put the blower and dust bins.
Depending on how extensive you make your ducting, the blower cost can be a small part of the expenditure. As an example, my cyclone cost about $1300; the duct, gates, etc. was probably another $2000. You can mitigate the cost by using flex and move it to the machine you're using, of course.

As to the size of the blower, I can have several gates open at the same time and get good collection with my 3hp unit. Years ago, I started with a 1.5hp DC from Penn State and it worked great with one side of the wye going to my tablesaw full time and the other side on flex for whatever else I was using.

I'm now using the 1.5hp blower as an exhaust fan in my finish area - works pretty good.
 
Jeff, I bought the harbor freight DC. For blowing outside into a trailer or pile, I think it more than satisfactory for that job. Wonder if you could find a similar unit on Craigslist. For my school shop, for the 9 lathes running, the DC did make a difference but for the fine dust, I just purchased and hung a JET air cleaner. That made a huge difference! I would have to wipe my eye glasses off at the end of each class hour, now with it running, I find I don't even have to wipe them off at the end of the day!! This unit now that I have purchased it, will build one for my home shop. It is all about filters and blower (old furnace blower). I haven't checked, but remember a post a year or so back that someone built one for their shop.
 
Here you go a shop built air filter.

About $50 for the bag filter inside the unit & 2 pleated furnace filters. Built from scrapes & a free 3 speed heat system fan system.

I don't know where to get the filter bag now days, I purchased mine a Grizzly but don't know if they have them anymore. Front of the system holds 2 filters 12" x 24".
This has worked real well for me. I have another unit that is smaller & 1 speed that I can set behind my lathe & with a mask it helps a bunch.
 

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The problem for respiratory systems is not what you see, but the microscopic stuff you can not see. From what little I understand that it what hurts you and most dust collectors and filtersw just keep this airborne making the situation worse.

You needs LOTS of airflow at the cut to pull the dust in before it becomes airborne. So it's not about keep the shop clean, it's keeping the air clean and that is what I am looking at. I work with cedar which can be very toxic to some people. I don't want to develop that allergy and have to give up woodworking.
 
I agree... In any case I would wear a good filter mask. I turned some rosewood once with no mask, at the time not being aware of of how toxic the dust from it was & learned the hard way. I wear a mask all the time now when turning at the lathe.

When I get my shop set up again I'll have the filter system behind the lathe & a filter mask as well as a fan blowing toward the filter system.

I look great with my double filter mask clear face shield & a set of Peltors on. I may sound like Darth Vader even if I don't look like him.

I thought my dogs would go crazy but no they just wagged their tails...ya we know it's you.

The strange thing is with a beard I can put the mask on & cover the filters with my hands & inhale & it still collapses the mask toward my face & works great. It's a 3M mask.
 
My practice was eyes---mainly glasses, contact lenses, straightening crossed eyes, etc. In spite of that I saw a very large number of foreign bodies, chemical burns, etc.

Now it sounds like the above has nothing to do with dust collection, HOWEVER IT DOES! Seeing the things that happen to eyes without eye protection made me very aware that all kinds of things can and will happen to lungs that do not get the proper air. My first priority to start into woodworking was the dust collection system. Money went there FIRST.

Yes, it is the fine particles that you cannot see that are the deadly particles. In making or working with glazes for ceramics the law is, "If you can smell it you are getting it."

Or to put it yet another way, If you could have one look at a dissected lung from a person who died of inhaling small particles, you would instantly become aware that you would get decent Dust Collection or take up collecting restaurant napkins instead of woodworking.

This is the same kind of problem we have with patients who have to take drops to control their glaucoma. The patient's view: I am taking these expensive eye drops that are a bit uncomfortable to take. I don't see any difference so I will quit taking them. The doctor's view: They didn't take their drops so the nerves degenerated and now they are blind and there is no cure for this.

Using a blower to Vent the dust outside of your shop, using a Shop Vac at a machine, using an air recirculating unit with a filter, etc. are NOT making clean air for your lungs. These things just give you an illusion of safety. If money was tight and I could do only one thing I would invest in a good quality mask. Ideally this mask would have filtered air pumped into it. However, a good mask using canisters with a rating of N95 or higher is a good, viable, start.

Even the air I pump outside with my DC has gone through 1 micron filters. That is overkill. I purchased the DC before I knew I was going to build a building outside of my shop to house the DC and air compressor.

Sorry! I will get off of my platform now. I just want woodworkers to have long, healthy lives.

Enjoy,

JimB
 
This is one I can't figure out.

My Dad never had DC & worked in the building & cabinet industry all his life from 16 until retirement & then a few years rebuilding RV travel trailers & double plank mahogany boats, smoked Roytan cigars 50 from Friday evening until Thursday purchased another handful of cigars to make it through till Friday night when he again purchased another box of 50. He didn't smoke at work???? He quit in smoking 1962 & has the lungs of a 16 year old according to his doctor. He is 89 years old.

Get this in the last month he has framed up a 6' x 12' sloped roof between his gambrel roofed shed & his manufactured home & closed it in on both ends & built doors to match the shed, all this to park his yard tractor, wheelbarrow & yard tools in. He worked 3-4 hours a day while taking care of himself & going up to a care center to visit & help care for his 92 year old wife. Folks all I got to say is we've done something wrong in our lives & need to figure out what it is.

It has nothing or very little to do with DC. I'm thinking. Not that DC isn't a good idea, it really is so make it a priority.
 
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I hear you in regards to the respritory issues Jeff. I have the Grizzly 2 hp cyclone that they sell and with the christmas sales coming up they might have a good deal similar to when I bought mine it was around 600. I also have a 800 CFM air filter that I really should use way more than I do. Also with the respritory stuff I wear a half mask North dust mask and I use the NeilMed Sinus rinse and it all works great. I have cut my use of any ventalators down to the the odd occassion. It takes time to get it all working as the lungs take a long time to recover but they do. I am living proof that it does work.

As for a blower have you looked for an old oil furnace blower assembly? I used one in my first shop and it sucked everything outside. neighbor was a bit upset as it blew all over his yard but my shop was pretty clean. :D
 
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