Spanish Cedar Finish Problems?

Randy Hunter

Member
Messages
8
Location
Rockport, TX
I have Spanish Cedar bathroom cabinets. They were installed about 5 years ago. The cabinet shop used a stain, a glaze and then a lacquer spay on final finish.
After about 1 year, the finish began to crackle in a few places, and slowly has covered most of the exposed areas.
I do not know the source of the wood, or the moisture content.
In one area, it appears that an area that does not get any sunlight does not have the issue. In addition, the inside on the doors also looks fine at this point.
Some areas on the boxes have some hard wood plywood, and this finish is fine.

In addition, I used the same cabinets in a butlers pantry, where the sunlight is very low, if at all. Some areas have also begun to crackle.

Any suggestions? Should I strip the existing finish and try to refinish with a poly?
Do I need to trash the cabinets and try another wood?

I am new to Family Woodworking, and looking for some help. Thanks! See the attached pictures.
 

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Randy, Welcome to the family. Glad you found us and I hope one of our finishing experts will chime in with some suggestions for you. I have about a hundred b/f of Spanish cedar out in the shop, but have only used it on small boxes and haven't put a finish on it. I do know it is prone to resin spots and it's possible that the same natural oils that work to form the resin spots have messed with your finish. Sorry I can't be of any more help.
 
i would get in touch with the cabinet maker and see what they say, i have seen the cracking before on another cabinet but it was with precat lacquer and that person isnt here at the moment to ask his situation..
 
Cabinet shop uses ML Cambell Magnalaq - Precat lacquer. I have many walnut cabinets sprayed from same shop but no problems. Retail distributor was puzzeled and said product may have gone on too heavy.
Where cracks are the worst it appears that you can actually see the raw wood. I notice that ML Cambell has a help section on the web and I have not contacted them yet but will do so. Thanks for the comments.
 
i have seen that cause trouble with the same product, the coats in between may not have had enough time to gas off properly. i use ML cambell and used to use magna lac but now use magna max.. the film thickness shouldnt excede 3 mills i believe to be right.. ask dave hawksford this question he is a guru of finishing..
 
Dave,
The inside of the cabinets (including fake drawer fronts and stiles) were not sealed.
The inside of the doors were sealed. BOTH areas have equal amounts of cracked finish.

The problems with the finish have appeared over a period of time....approx 4 years, and continue to increase.
I have read several articles lately about Spanish Cedar....several articles say that Spanish Cedar may have issues with resin or sap continuing to seep from the wood for several years, and that we may never be able to get a good finish.

Do you think the problem is the wood, or the glaze or lacquer that was used?
Thanks!
 
Dave,
Thanks.
With a curing problem....do I have any options?
What if I remove the lacquer and try to seal it with poly?
What about a paint solution?
or Do I have to trash these cabinets and start over with some other wood?
 
Think I figured it out. Seen once before, well more like it happened to me. When useing a oil wiping stain and not allowing the drying time to take place before applying sealer you will get that alligatoring effect. We are doing a very large table right now and I am giving the drying time 4 days. I knew i'd seen this. Could be wrong but that's a strong probability.
 
Dave,
Thanks for your continued thoughts on this problem. I did attempt to reach Jack, but was unable to connect with him.
I am attaching a couple more pictures....I had the same cabinet shop build the fireplace mantel and bookcase surround. They completed this project about one year after the bathroom cabinets, using the same Spanish Cedar wood, distressed, with a glaze and the precat lacquer.
I have included an overall picture, plus a few close ups. The mantel square box with was made of plywood, and the fluted column pieces are Spanish Cedar. The final picture is the one that has me confused....it is a final trim board over the fluded side columns. This actually never got installed...it was placed infront on the column. As you see, the alligatoring effect stops where the trim square coved the column...why did this happen? A third project was done for this home, again with the Spanish Cedar. It is in a butlers pantry off the dining room that does not get any daylight. Some of the finish is beginning to show the same alligatoring effect....again this started 3-4 years after the cabinets were installed.
If the drying time of the oil wiping stain is the issue....would daylight and exposure to air be reason for the change in issues to the finish?
As you can see....I have a massive problem with cabinets in three rooms all with the same issue. Really appreciate your thoughts on this issue.
 

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So if the cracking is stopping at the edge of the shadow your dealing with wood tention. movement with in the wood caused by tempture fluctuation. Are you using a humidifier in your home ?.
 
Dave,
This home is approx 6000 sq ft, with a whole house dehumidifier. The dehumidifier was installed on the 2nd floor (game room with taxidermy items), but may have some effect to the moisture level downstairs. The home is on the Texas coast...very humidy area. The home was constructed with ICF (Insulated Concrete Forms) and is sealed very tight. Humidity levels downstairs tend to be closer to 60 percent, but the upstairs we keep at about 50 percent.
You mentioned the crackle stopping at the "shadow"....not sure what you mean.
In a previous comment you said to just strip it and use a BALIN stain....what is this?
As a reminder....the plywood box above the fireplace opening (with the shell applique) has NO signs of alligator. (See picture #1 and #3) There is a 6" return to the right of the plywood which is not clear in the picture. The Spanish Cedar is on the back wall (6" back).
Thanks again for your help. I will try to reach Jack again to see what he can add to the conversation.
 
Dave,
None of the cabinets are in rooms that take DIRECT sunlight. The bathroom and fireplace living room wall are located to get indirect sunlight in the room. The thrid area of concern is in the butlers pantry that does not even get indirect sunlight....a very dark area with no natural light. This area is also beginning to get the crackle issue.
The one strange area is where one finished piece of wood was directly ontop of another piece of wood, and when you remove the top board, you see that the crackle issue stops exactly where the top board covered the bottom board....see the last group of pictures I sent, and the final picture.

Jim D....thanks for your comments on the Behlen's stain. I will look for this.

Randy
 
Now after all you've said Spanish Cedar is a spongy wood, meaning it sooks up moisture. Which means it expands and contracts. The hard finish will give by cracking. I've worked with Spanish cedar in the past and the finish we used on it in Peru was a wax finish. So strip it down go with a easy colored wax finish. Then all you need to do is buff. Now you can use a bhelin stain and wax over it.
 
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