Material Cost & Other Questions for 3D Printer?

Bill Arnold

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OK, you guys have me real curious about taking this step in my tool arsenal. The thing I'd like to understand is the cost of making an item such as you've done. The cost for a reel of ABS and PLA seems cheap enough at pennies per meter, but how many meters or centimeters are required for items like you have made?

Also, it seems that ABS is the way to go for anything that has to hold up to any real use. Opinion?
 
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I've not used ABS yet, only PLA, but do plan to pick some up. We can use it as our printers have got heated beds, but abs shrinks considerably, so an enclosure may be needed for larger prints otherwise delamination can occur if parts are cooling too fast due to cool environments.

For the PLA, I think Brent and I both have ordered it on Amazon. Cost has been $20 to $25 so far for the 1 Kg rolls. I'm not sure of the exact length on the roll, but around 330 meters on the 1.75mm filament rolls. My buzz lightyear project used about 22 meters of filament, with only a 10% infill. If I had done it as a solid infill, it would have used about 83 meters. It was plenty strong at 10% and a cross hatch pattern used for the internal structure, then about 1 mm shell thickness.

Someone had asked if I ordered filament with the printer, I did not, it's a consumable and degrades over time and with humidity. So ordering from amazon would allow for returns if it wasn't to snuff. I also have a local Micro Center store that carries the filament, I think they are about $20 a roll there.
 
ok Bill, while I am not Darren or Brent but I have spent some time researching 3D printing. The method that both are using is called fused deposition modeling. It seems to have evolved as the lowest cost method of getting into the process. In doing FDM modeling both PLA and ABS are popular choices of materials PLA is where most people start since it is less fussy to begin with. ABS requires higher temps and has a tendency to shrink. In order to do ABS the printer needs to have a heated table for the material in order to prevent warping. That's the down side. The advantage to ABS is it is more durable, lego blocks are made of ABS. If you are making something that will be exposed to weather than ABS is a better choice.
from a cost standpoint the relative cost is about the same, my research says about 50 cents an once for either one. That's my 2 cents worth. I wait to see what Darren and Brent have to say.
 
Darren,

I was assuming I'd need an enclosure to control the fumes and vent them outside. After reading more, I see that's really necessary with ABS. I'll experiment with both PLA and ABS but should probably use ABS for most of what I plan.


Don,

Thanks for the input. The printer the other guys have that I'm looking at has a heated bed, so it's good to go for ABS. As you said, the cost is similar for either PLA or ABS. The rolls I've seen are something like $0.06-$0.07 per meter.


Anyone,

From what I've read so far, it appears one should use a barrier between the printer bed and ABS when printing to ease the process of removing the object. Comments?
 
Again, I haven't used abs yet, but plan to. Yes, you should work in a well ventilated area or use a vent as both release VOC's. I've got a small bathroom fan setup currently, which will be incorporated into the final enclosure I build.

The machine came with a pretty rough masking tape on the bed, the first few pieces stuck to it well, then I got a tear and replace it with the blue masking tape. I don't know if I simply got it out of calibration or the filament just wasn't sticking to the blue tape. I've since gone back to using regular masking tape in combination with a good coat of glue stick on the bed (some folks use hairspray). I think I'm still not doing something quite correct on my first layer (it's maybe set too thick) as I really shouldn't have to use the glue or hairspray, I'm not sure Brent is using any.

I bought one of the little spatulas for removing the prints, worth every penny. I've used my pocket knife a couple of times where I just couldn't get the edge of the spatula under, then switched over.
 
I'm actually pretty impressed with PLA so far on the things I've printed.

I'll have to come up with a good reason to switch to using ABS, maybe for out door use or something, but this is working real good so far.

I'm printing using PLA inside, and the fumes don't seem to be much of a problem.

The nice thing about Simplfiy3d is that it gives you a length and cost estimate for each object you print based on how much filament you are going to use.
 
I'm actually pretty impressed with PLA so far on the things I've printed.

I'll have to come up with a good reason to switch to using ABS, maybe for out door use or something, but this is working real good so far.

I'm printing using PLA inside, and the fumes don't seem to be much of a problem.

The nice thing about Simplfiy3d is that it gives you a length and cost estimate for each object you print based on how much filament you are going to use.

Obviously, I'm just getting into researching this stuff a bit deeper. I've read that ABS is preferred for anything that gets routine usage like jig parts, etc. It also holds up to heat well but that shouldn't be an issue for most items around my shop.

One writer said he found the fumes from PLA to be rather pleasant. On the other hand, fumes from ABS can be deadly! I can set up plenty of ventilation in my shop.

Does the printer come with operational software? One of the FAQs indicated there is some on the packaged SD card. Looks like there's a lot of free software out there to start with.
 
Obviously, I'm just getting into researching this stuff a bit deeper.

Bill don't fall into the same trap I have fallen into,I started my research over a year ago and am still researching, I think I have found the meaning of the saying "analysis is paralysis"I may be over analyzing and should just take the plunge,my problem I only want to buy once.
 
Bill don't fall into the same trap I have fallen into,I started my research over a year ago and am still researching, I think I have found the meaning of the saying "analysis is paralysis"I may be over analyzing and should just take the plunge,my problem I only want to buy once.


I hear ya, Don! Darren and Brent posting their experiences with Anet A8 show me a path to an inexpensive machine. I use SketchUp routinely for 3D modeling and can export STL files from it. Closing the loop will now be deciding on printer host software to actually drive the machine.
 
So, You need something for design. For me, Sketchup does that quite nicely and there is a free export to STL extension in the extension warehouse.


The other thing you need is a slicer. There are some free ones, like Cura that work pretty good. But It does have some drawbacks.

Both Darren and I went with Simplify3d pretty quickly. It's a little pricy (149$), but it sure seems to be worth it. It seems to have better algorithms for determining the tool paths, and has other nice features in the preview and working stages that can save you time.

From my experience, it also creates smoother, nicer looking end products, and any supports you need to build into it are done much more nicely and snap right off.

I know about the 'buy it once' philosophy quite well, but on some of these things, it's nice to get some thing cheap to learn on and figure out the ins and outs before upgrading.

So far though, for small projects, I'm really happy. The only thing I could see upgrading for would be multiple print heads or a larger print volume.
 
There are more expensive turnkey type machines available as well.

The question is what do you do when something goes wrong on those? Sure with these cheap ones you have to put it together and go through some learning pains, but you'll know exactly what makes it tick.
 
So, You need something for design. For me, Sketchup does that quite nicely and there is a free export to STL extension in the extension warehouse.

The other thing you need is a slicer. There are some free ones, like Cura that work pretty good. But It does have some drawbacks.

Both Darren and I went with Simplify3d pretty quickly. It's a little pricy (149$), but it sure seems to be worth it.

I already have the STL extension for SketchUp and use SU routinely.

I'm looking at slicers now but there seem to be plenty to choose from.

I'll probably do much as I did with my CNC machine: Start with free software until I know more about what I'm doing or can't do what I want effectively, then get Simplify3D



There are more expensive turnkey type machines available as well.

The question is what do you do when something goes wrong on those? Sure with these cheap ones you have to put it together and go through some learning pains, but you'll know exactly what makes it tick.

I never considered a turnkey machine. I'm too cheap! :)

I learned more by building my CNC from a kit than I ever could have with a turnkey machine. That's why I like the idea of a kit for 3D printing.
 
I think Brent and I are each finding a few little things that need to be improved upon for these printers. Biggest one and most needed is simply adding a 20 amp fuse on the power cord, the printer doesn't have a switch either, I'll be adding one of those soon. I plugged it in to see what kind of amps it pulled while warming the bed and hot end, and was peaking out at about 15 amps. The power supply is rated for 20 amps, so plan for a dedicated outlet just for the printer as ABS will pull a little more power as the hot end and bed both run hotter for it than PLA.

We've each ordered a mosfet board for the running the bed. The bed pulls most of the amps, so moving that extra power off the controller board helps prolong it's life. Several folks have posted about the power connections overheating and melting on the board. I haven't notice any issues, but not going to take a chance with it. The mosfet board was about $18, could use a mechanical relay or SSD instead.

Even with these little issues, I'm not regretting the purchase at all.

You can run the printer from either usb and one of the slicer softwares, or you can export the gcode and run it from the sd card directly on the printer. I'm still running from the printer's SD, but plan to setup a dedicated computer for running it when I get time.

I spent quite a bit of time this past week watching reviews and comparisons of the slicer software. I think working in each of them got me pretty familiar with all the concepts. I probably could get by with the Cura software, it seemed the most refined of the free versions, but after watching some of the side by side comparisons I noticed that the simplify3d just had a more refined movement for the same drawings. I did a couple of objects that needed supports in each, Cura just seemed to forget or did overkill. Slic3r added plenty, but you had no control over where they showed up and the ones that were added I couldn't get removed as they were fused too much to the piece. Simplify3d did a great job, you can add where they go and delete ones you don't want, the pattern/process it uses to add them makes the very easy to remove. Like with some of the cnc software, it all does the same stuff, but some of it just does it better than others.
 
Darren,

Thanks for the heads-up about off-loading the current demand of the bed. I have an SSR laying around here. Where did you get the mosfet board?

Cura seems to be a good starting point, but I can already see myself going with Simplify3D a few months down the road. That's reminiscent of starting with free software on my CNC, then biting the bullet and getting VCarve!
 
Darren,

Thanks for the heads-up about off-loading the current demand of the bed. I have an SSR laying around here. Where did you get the mosfet board?

Cura seems to be a good starting point, but I can already see myself going with Simplify3D a few months down the road. That's reminiscent of starting with free software on my CNC, then biting the bullet and getting VCarve!

Got it from here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/322360526265

I felt the same way about the software, having flashbacks to the cnc software. This the one comparison that really sold me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrZWAkB8rbg

After the nightmare of the supports from slic3r being fused to my part, the supports in simplify3d have just been a dream to remove. Cura should work fine, but I really see a difference in the way my machine runs and quality of the prints when there are small parts involved.
 
Darren,

Thanks for the link to the mosfet device and for the comparison video. I can already see the handwriting on the charge slip! :)

No Problem! :D

Hey, btw, I was wrong about needing a dedicated circuit, it actually peaked out at 1.5 amps during pre-heat, not 15 amps. I guess when I looked at my meter it was at an angle and all the decimal points were showing. I confirmed this with some other owners posts about the question. Seeing all the threads showing melted board threads, I was quick to jump to conclusions.
 
Hey, btw, I was wrong about needing a dedicated circuit, it actually peaked out at 1.5 amps during pre-heat, not 15 amps. I guess when I looked at my meter it was at an angle and all the decimal points were showing. I confirmed this with some other owners posts about the question. Seeing all the threads showing melted board threads, I was quick to jump to conclusions.

That being said, It's really the difference in AC and DC. The ac Power supply is pulling down the 1.5 amps at 110, but that little heated bed might be pulling some decent amps at 12 volts DC. Especially if you need to heat that bed up to ABS levels, I think thats why the connectors on the mainboard have been melting.
 
That being said, It's really the difference in AC and DC. The ac Power supply is pulling down the 1.5 amps at 110, but that little heated bed might be pulling some decent amps at 12 volts DC. Especially if you need to heat that bed up to ABS levels, I think thats why the connectors on the mainboard have been melting.
I noticed we have the updated screw terminals rather the the pins that were melting, but still going with the mosfet myself.

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