I'm dreaming of a welded christmas

Bill Lantry

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Hey, folks,

Christmas is coming, and Doorlink is asking what I want. I'm thinking I don't have any welding capacity in my shop, and several times this year I found myself wishing I did. So I'm thinking of asking for a welder setup. But the more I read, the more I realize that what I know about welding would fit in a thimble. So here's my question. I'm sure that what I'd do would be considered "light duty" Is *this* a reasonable option?

http://www.grizzly.com/products/110V-MIG-Welder/H8155

Is there something better out there in a similar range? What else do I need?

All input welcomed...

Thanks,

Bill
 
Bill,

I can't comment on this unit as I've neither seen nor used one. I will comment on wire feed welders in general. I have a small MIG of my own, made by Miller. It uses an external gas bottle for shielding and it works very well. I have tried a flux core wire in a couple of Campbell Hausfeld units (we do the warranty for them at work), and I didn't like the way they welded at all - lots of spatter and gaps in the weld bead. It's entirely possible that the poor results I obtained were due to incorrect procedure, but ... I don't think so. Others experiences may be different and better.

cheers eh?
 
I have done a lot of welding and I have to second the comment that Miller makes a great welder, and yes definitely get a wire feed unit. I'm not familiar with the Grizzley unit , but I can't imagine a 110 volt unit being of much use for anything but sheet metal. You need to check for the duty cycle on whatever welder you decide on, this means how long you can use the welder every hour of operation without stopping, if you aren't familiar with the term. Good luck with your decision
Chuck
 
Depends on what you plan to weld, but you can get an oxyacetylene rig and do quite a lot. You can also braze with it if you just want to hook two pieces of steel together.

It's fairly easy to learn to gas weld.

Mike
 
I agree with John and Charles-----Miller is very good if not better. I understand Hobarts are also good but have not used them. I have no idea about the Grizzly welders. I think that you would be dissapointed over time if you bought a welder that light duty. Looking at the specs you can ony weld material about 1/6" thick, at least with one pass. I think that to be real useful you need a unit that could handle at least 1/4" thick material. I think that something like this would be a good buy regarding capabilities vs price. http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200306073_200306073

This way you would also be able to use sheilding gas if it was required such as welding aluminum or stainless steel.
 
I am no welding expert - far from it. I have a little Lincoln MIG unit that started with flux core wire. I would agree with what John said about the flux core spatter etc. It works, but is messy. I upgraded the unit with a gas kit - now I just need a bottle.:rolleyes: It doesn't look like the Grizzly unit can be upgraded. I would go with gas on the MIG if you can.

FWIW,
Wes
 
If you have a welding supply place near you that is a good place to start. The guys know what they are talking about which can be a real help. Sometimes they have some good prices also. If you have the time a class can really give you a head start. I know as I learned what I could on the farm growing up and from books. A ton of wasted time and bad welds. I'm still not much good but can stick things together.
 
Bill, my brother is an accomplished welder and woodworker. But he absolutely won't use them in the same shop. Too much risk of a spark smoldering in some hidden sawdust. When he retired, he sold all his welding and metal working gear, and now only does woodworking.

Consider whether you have two separate work areas, or want to take the risk, etc. Can you trade services with a friend or neighbor who has a welder but no woodworking equipment?
 
Miller and Hobart are both owned by Illinois Tool Works, and there is some overlap in their product lines, I believe they do have some separate manufacturing still. Both are excellent lines of machines.

Wire feed is just a hair more difficult than hot gluing, the most common gotchas being too little/too much power for the thickness you're trying to weld, too little/too much wire feed for your power setting, and too much voltage drop for portable units (make up a nice big cord if you want to move around, and it'll weld a lot better). A day or so of fooling around will probably get you up to speed fairly well.

I've mostly done gas shielded welding, which is cleaner and a bit easier than flux core, but flux core has its place and can be used very effectively for many tasks. One use where flux core is desirable is welding outside, if there's any kind of breeze, your gas shield tends to blow away. You also can generally weld thicker materials with flux core wire, as its a larger conductor.

I've used several light duty 110 units, some will do 1/4", some will not. All that I've used will do 1/8", and though I've not used the one you linked to, it looks like that's about its limit. Lincoln makes a similar unit for a similar price that HD carries. Should be ok for occasional light use, though I tend to prefer heavier units. HD also has a 110V lincoln that will do 1/4" for about $100 more, which would probably be my minimum starting point.

Another alternative is a stick welder. Harder to self-teach, but not impossible, and a bit harder to use, but has a greater capacity for the price you pay. Needs 220v too, that can be a bit of a limiting factor.
 
Another alternative is a stick welder. Harder to self-teach, but not impossible, and a bit harder to use, but has a greater capacity for the price you pay. Needs 220v too, that can be a bit of a limiting factor.

These are true statements. I use a stick welder at home because it is what I have always used as a personal welder and I am to cheap to get a good MIG welder. I would trade my stick in a minute for the same capacity MIG if I didn't have to put out the extra dollars. I only use mine six or eight times a year now so cannot really justify it. Maybe others would not feel the same.

Charlie is right about not mixing flamable materials with welders. Not a real big of problem if you are careful and/or do not mind puting out small fires every now and then.
 
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Yep, Miller owns Hobart. My Hobart Handler 175 (a 200V machine) is one of the best purchases I've made, period. I've gotten a ton of use out of it, and I've been able to do things that I would not have even tired with the stick welder. Stick welding is great for welding up tractors and bumpers on big trucks, in fact I'd rather have a stick welder to do this work than a MIG any day, but stick welders have the problem of learning curve, yes it is not that hard, yes I can weld sticks fairly well, if you give me an hour and a a dozen sticks to burn through, as I've not touched my stick welder in a couple of years, oh, and I'd need some new sticks, as I'm sure mine are all too old and have sucked up too much moisture by now :doh:

For ease of use and the occasional use the MIG is hard to beat, the flux core works fine, but is it messy and not nearly as neat as the gas shield welding, IN the shop, outside, you got to use flux core, or build a substantial wind break. Even inside, I find I have to turn off any fans and the AC if I don't want my gas sheilding blowing away.

I would recommend that you get a 200V unit, with this, you will be able to weld just about anything you want to, or need to, with the 100V units, it seems to me that you are always pushing the limits. One other quick thing, you do NOT have to use the CO2/Argon mix to weld steel with a MIG, straigh CO2 works fine, burns a bit hotter and is not quite as neat, but you can get CO2 tanks WAY cheaper than the "Welding" tanks, I use one from our beer servers, you could get one from the Coke guys, you know, for the soda pop, may not be exactly cricket, but it works just dandy for me :dunno:

I can even weld stainless, with the right wire, which I have one reel of, and I weld aluminum, which is HARD to do.

The advice of going to a real welding shop is good advice, they often have reconditioned machines for sale, not great for a shop that is running a welder 8 hours a day, but just fine for a DIYer who is using it 8 times a year.

If you buy a good welder, and you learn how to use it, you will be surprised at the number of things that you can weld, mixing the two, wood and metal in design and such for furniture is something to be explored as well.

Charlie's comments on fire are really on the nose, I'm so paranoid about it in the Dungeon, I do a super clean up before I weld, and I have the hatch open and run the exhaust as soon as I stop welding, I make sure my wife knows I'm welding and after I'm done, do not leave the Dungeon for at least an hour afterwards to watch for any thing smoldering or such. I wish I had a separate area to weld, but I do not, but I do the best I can safety wise, though some with not agree with even that.

Get a good quality machine, get a gas bottle machine, get a 200V machine, also take a lesson, and get the auto darkening shield, maybe not right away, but get one, and make sure it is a "Good" one as well.

Cheers!
 
Just like everything in life there are pros and cons to whatever you choose. My family has a fleet of trucks and I have welded and fabricated just about anything you can imagine , and quite a few you wouldn't want to.
If you are just going to be piddling on small clean metal the mig welder is great. Shorter learning curve on steel and you can weld aluminum with a Mig, but that is a different animal all together. You will need to buy shield gas from a distributor, something you will not need on a stick welder. A mig does not do well outdoors if there is much of a breeze or indoors in front of a fan. If I remember correctly, a 3MPH breeze is enough to blow the shield gas away. A stick welder does not require you to have the metal as clean as a Mig, but they don't weld aluminum well.
If it was me I would buy the largest Mig I could afford, because of the versatility it offers.
I would definitely advise you get some type of training whatever way you go. And I will second what Charlie said, no way would I put a welder in my cabinet shop. Way too much potential for fire. Best of luck.
 
Stick with a major brand name

I have been welding for over 30 years, 28 in the defense industry and now building concrete pumping trucks. I have a Lincoln 110 volt welder but it is the largest one they make befor needing 220. It came set up for shielding gas from the factory. If you have 220v capacity, go that way. Miller and Hobart also make excellent units. The gasless wire works better if you are outside in a breeze, but the solid wire will give you a weld with less spatter. If you go the stick route, make sure you get the one with DC capability. The low hydrogen rods do not run very good on AC. AC is fine if you can get by with 6011 or 6013 rods. If you need to run aluminum wire you won't be happy without a spool gun or a push-pull system. With just a push feeder, there is too much chance for the aluminum wire to kink. You also need to run argon gas with aluminum. Steel wire can be run with CO2 gas or a mix of argon/co2. I do my welding in the driveway so I don't have to worry about sparks in the sawdust but if it is anything major I go to a friends shop. Also, make sure you get the proper shade of lens in your helmet. There is nothing worse than arc flash in your eyes. Sorry to ramble.
 
The Grizzly may be a great unit, but service, and accessories aren't going to be available locally. For example, if you need a hose liner, you aren't going to be able to walk into a local welding supplier and pick one up. I bought a Hobart Handler 180 last year at Tractor Supply. Hobart has since replaced the 180 with the 187 which has more voltage taps (settings). On mine, some of the drive parts have the Miller logo stamped right on them so it appears that at least part of the drive is shared. I'm really happy with mine. It is a 220V machine. My brother has, I think, the 140 which is the largest 110 machine and he is really happy with his as well. I also looked at Lincoln, but a similar Lincoln machine was almost $500 more out the door. I later found that one of the other local welding suppliers carries the Hobart machines with a welding supply co-op's private label (Weldmark?) at very competitive prices. I would have bought there if I had known just for the support aspect. My brother's machine is labeled Weldmark. I later bought a Thermodyne plasma cutter from the local Airgas store. I seriously considered a generic but when it came right down to it, I couldn't see spending $500 on a throw away machine instead of $1000 on a good one from an industry leader.

Don't forget all the accessories you are going to want--a good hood (I'm quite happy with my Harbor Freight auto-dark hood), good gloves, a welding jacket with leather sleeves, wire, gas, a grinder, metal cutting tools, clamps .... The welder comes with basics for some of the above, but you'll probably want to replace them pretty quick.

If you aren't sure you want to spend the money to get a good machine, look into taking a welding class at your local community college or vocational school. See if you like welding enough to justify the good stuff.
 
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I'm not a welder. But used a 110V unit one time. Exercise in frustration. A 'real' welder friend calls the 110V units 'buzz boxes'. Not much good for anything other than making a little noise.
 
Some great advice here.

Miller owns Hobart, and a lot of the parts are interchangeable. My Hobart Handler 175 has a Miller gun and hose on it.

Take a class if you can, worth every penny of the price of admission.

Cheers!
 
I purchased a refurbished Hobart 180 from toolking.com. I have had no problems with it. They had a good deal and fast shipping. It is about a year old now.
 
I have a MillerMatic 35 which is a 150 220v welder which welds the thicker materials. It is an older unit that I paid around $500 for and you can use it all day long and it never skips a beat. I also have a newer Hobart Handler 145 that is 110v and plugs into standard wall outlets. It is really convenient not to have to pull out the big welder to weld something that is thinner metal, and can be done with the smaller Hobart. I bought the Hobart used as well for $250, and it was pratically new and came with a cart and flow guage. If you are patient you can find some really good used welders, especially around this time of year. I would go with a 110v unit, as they are more versatile, and I would go with a name brand welder, that way you can buy parts and get service if needed. As others have said Hobart and Miller are owned by the same company, and you really can't go wrong with either welder. Good Luck. Bill
 
I also have the Hobart 175 Handler....I used it when restoring my 69 Chevelle, did a great job on sheet metal and I also use it on the heavier stuff.

I grew up on a stick welder, and still use one, but I am really pleased with the Hobart.
 
Gentlemen,

Thanks for the input. I now know exactly what I need.

Only one problem: I was dining with my beloved Doorlink the other night, and she delicately inquired as to my desires for a Noel Cadeau. I replied "welder". Her response was, sadly, unprintable... ;)

But I've not given up. I *will* acquire one, but not this month, and certainly not before I get the laundry room done. And the basement. And her kitchen... ;)

Thanks,

Bill
 
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