Jet haters

Frank Fusco

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Location
Mountain Home, Arkansas
Interesting how different folks look at the same thing and come up with different twists. I belong to a gunsmithing forum and recently there was talk about a Jet machinist’s lathe.
The guys on the forum spoke of Jet with nothing less than pure hate and venom. Most called Jet equipment ‘cheap Chinese knock-offs’.
On some forums, especially the ones for penturners, the forums are practically houses of worship for things Jet. Curiously, those same forums, and people, often hate Grizzly equipment, even though both brands usually come off the same assembly lines. Oh, well.
Folks is funny critters.
 
Frank, this is kinda like chevy vs. ford, huh? I think indepentant reviews of machines on forums are great. The problem, as you know very well:rolleyes:, that some will get nasty and say "...nothing less than pure hate and venom."

Green(relish), white(mayo), yellow(mustard), gray, blue...whatever the color, if the price is right for me and the reviews are positive and not full of hate and venom, I trust them and will buy accordingly. I usually ignore the ranting reviews.
 
I've got green stuff and white stuff and grey stuff and maybe even some other colors of stuff in my shop. It's all good to great IMO. I used to cuss some of my tools, but as I used them more I found out that it is more often the Indiginous North American Person and not the arrows that are the issue when the target is not hit. :rofl: I think that most of my machines are capable of much more accuracy than I am able to get them to perform.
 
There there are people like me that think if it was made past the 1950's regardless of brand it ain't worth owning. ;) :rofl:


On the serious side I am not a big fan of the imports. I honestly don't think they are made as well as the old machines and that you can get a far superior product by buying an old one and rebuilding it. Of course that is not for everyone. I think that the quality of the cast iron is inferior comparing the imports to the old American made machines. Much softer and more likely to break.

On the other hand, they may be perfectly adequate too. You don't hear a lot about stripped bolts and broken parts. So the Old Arn is probably overkill but I like overkill on machines. One of my biggest problems with new machines is most new smaller stuff is disposable. If it breaks it gets replaced, not repaired.

I have a Grizzly 14" bandsaw and it's been a great saw. No serious complaints, just a couple of minor ones. So it boils down to personal preference. I honestly don't think your going to tell any difference in the wood coming off the machine. And I bet if your could run the machines color blind (so to speak) your wouldn't see much difference.
 
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Frank, this is kinda like chevy vs. ford, huh? I think indepentant reviews of machines on forums are great. The problem, as you know very well:rolleyes:, that some will get nasty and say "...nothing less than pure hate and venom."

Green(relish), white(mayo), yellow(mustard), gray, blue...whatever the color, if the price is right for me and the reviews are positive and not full of hate and venom, I trust them and will buy accordingly. I usually ignore the ranting reviews.

Jeff, very true. There were factors involved in my recent decision to buy a Grizzly lathe other than specs and color.
Color does contribute to some fun debates. Steve and I used to josh over red and green tractors. Mine was red and, naturally, better than the greens. ;)
As I like to say, "Folks is funny critters."
 
On some forums, especially the ones for penturners, the forums are practically houses of worship for things Jet.
Well, it's tough to deny that the Jet Mini lathe is a source of much positive karma for the WMH group, and rightly so: it's kind of the Volkwagen Beetle of the small-scale woodworking world.

I suspect much of the difference between the perceptions of Jet between different customer groups lies in the expectations. It makes a lot of difference whether you're moving down from hard-core industrial-grade or up from light-weight consumer-oriented kit. (Or to put another way, whether you're in the market for "cheaper good stuff" vs "better cheap stuff".)
 
something tells me that a pen turner might have somewhat different expectations out of his 300$ jet mini than a machinist might have out of his 25-30k cnc mill...:rolleyes:or even a 8-15k metal lathe....
in the end the ol` "ya get what ya` paid for" is usually true.
 
I think on the gun smithing side you are dealing with a different level of precision. However with that being said and being a machinist in a past life I have found many of the import machine tools to be as of good or better precision than some of the old standby's For example there are much better mills out there the the original Bridgeport at much lower cost.

What I will say about some of the import line of wood working equipment is that it has afforded many more people to enter the world of wood working with much better equipment. By today's dollar for value it is my opinion that what you get today is a very good value. In long past years many home wood workers have been held to a cheaper consumer level of equipment that was not comparable to what we have available in a more industrial based import tool and many times at lower cost in today's dollars.


Good Luck

Alan
 
I think on the gun smithing side you are dealing with a different level of precision. However with that being said and being a machinist in a past life I have found many of the import machine tools to be as of good or better precision than some of the old standby's For example there are much better mills out there the the original Bridgeport at much lower cost.

What I will say about some of the import line of wood working equipment is that it has afforded many more people to enter the world of wood working with much better equipment. By today's dollar for value it is my opinion that what you get today is a very good value. In long past years many home wood workers have been held to a cheaper consumer level of equipment that was not comparable to what we have available in a more industrial based import tool and many times at lower cost in today's dollars.


Good Luck

Alan



I heard that a Lockheed-Martin plant in Texas recently replaced every machine in their entire factory with all Grizzly equipment. Can't be too shoddy if a company like that depends on them.
 
Frank,

A dear departed friend of mine was an outstanding gunsmith. One year he had two of the rifles he'd built in the benchrest US Nationals being shot by two different shooters. He was a machinest all of his adult life and worked for Speer company, set up their factory in Mexico, had his own machine shop in Alaska, sold it and returned to Lewiston. Returning to Lewiston, he strictly built guns and did a little consulting work at the local Speer/CCI factory when they encountered problems.

He thought that the old US built machines were the best but he had a Asian made milling machine that he used in building rifles. He said for the buck it was a great machine. BTW.....he thought the pre-war Winchester Model 70 actions were the best production made actions ever built. That is what he used when he built my 7mm-06.
 
Frank,

A dear departed friend of mine was an outstanding gunsmith. One year he had two of the rifles he'd built in the benchrest US Nationals being shot by two different shooters. He was a machinest all of his adult life and worked for Speer company, set up their factory in Mexico, had his own machine shop in Alaska, sold it and returned to Lewiston. Returning to Lewiston, he strictly built guns and did a little consulting work at the local Speer/CCI factory when they encountered problems.

He thought that the old US built machines were the best but he had a Asian made milling machine that he used in building rifles. He said for the buck it was a great machine. BTW.....he thought the pre-war Winchester Model 70 actions were the best production made actions ever built. That is what he used when he built my 7mm-06.



That's quite an endorsement.
You said, "BTW.....he thought the pre-war Winchester Model 70 actions were the best production made actions ever built. That is what he used when he built my 7mm-06."
Two thoughts on that. #1) Lucky you. Must be a fine rifle. #2) Some would say tearing about a pre-war Mod. 70 would be a sacrilege.
 
I have an issue with Jet, but that is only because I have had bad experiences with my JJ-6CXS.

First, when the jointer was new - never been run - the fence lock broke when I tightened the the lock as I was assembling the jointer. I am not a big person, so I don't think it should have broke that easy. I called Jet and the part was back ordered. The design was terrible. I am a mechanical engineer and I cant believe that the part had so little cross sectional area. I redesigned the part, the sleeve that it mates with, and had our machinist at work make the parts. I paid him with a case of beer. I offered to sell Jet my redesign, but they did not respond.

Second was vibration. I could not joint a smooth edge or face on a board. Again, Jet was unable to help me. I ended up putting a Power Twist belt on the jointer and you can still see a slight chatter from vibration.

Now that I look back, I should have returned the jointer.

I do have a Jet air cleaner and had a DC1100 and I had no problems with either machine.

I would have to think long and hard before I purchase another Jet tool. Not to say I won't, but it would be a very difficult decision.

Rich
 
something tells me that a pen turner might have somewhat different expectations out of his 300$ jet mini than a machinist might have out of his 25-30k cnc mill...:rolleyes:or even a 8-15k metal lathe....
in the end the ol` "ya get what ya` paid for" is usually true.

I agree to a point with what you said, Tod, but I guess I take that old saying a little further. Mine goes like this; You "ALWAYS PAY" for what you get, BUT, you "DON'T ALWAYS GET" what you PAY FOR.:D (At least that has been my personal experience, but on RARE occasions, I have been Pleasantly Surprised by better than expected quality/price). Unfortunately, there are SOME mfrs. that are much more Proficient at Pricing, than they are at design/manufacturing. (I hate it when that happens)
 
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A dear departed friend of mine was a gunsmith. One of the last guns he built before his Lou Gehrig's disease stopped him from his passion was my 7mm-06 or 280 Remingon, if you will. One year 2 of his newly made guns ended up with 2 different shooters at the Nationals Benchrest Competition and both of those guns ended up in the top five IIRC. He was a retired machinist by trade and bought one of those Taiwanese mills. He said for the money it was a good machine. His work seemed to prove it.
 
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