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What is art, and what is not, the endless debate.

Toni Ciuraneta

Toni Ciuraneta

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As I said this is a promising thread, only by debating we will be able to agree in certain points.

I would like to start discarding a common misconception. Whatever piece we observe cannot or should not be considered “art” only because of the difficulty in its making. If that was so, any piece made in a dark room, hanging down and wearing boxing gloves would be ”art” and I believe that the admiration that that exploit would create would not be considered art, would it?
To me art, is subjective by definition, that’s why it is so difficult to agree on what can be considered art or not. If it was objective, we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

So we can continue from here if anyone wishes, the debate is open.:unsure::huh:
 
Toni, the old saying Art is in the eye's of the beholder.
As a trained Illustrator and in fine artist I have my beefs with illustrated art vs lazy art, vs kitsch art, so as a traditionalist fine art is one thing, all else takes a lower category.
 
One person's trash is another one's treasure, or "art is in the eye of the beholder".

When I was first getting into woodworking seriously, a friend who happens to have a good eye for nice things said something like, "So, you're a wood artist." I had to let that set in for a while.
 
I go with the saying Art is in the Eye of the Beholder. Plus, everyone is entitled to their opinion. But I have to admit some things in this world I have seen that some say is "art", will make me wonder about that. But, not for long.
 
Interesting point of thought. So many abstract art pieces and paintings that I do not understand or comprehend in the least. Writing is also an art form and many books I don't understand or comprehend. Some because I chose not to. I am not trained in art in any way, shape or form. But I find explanations of abstract art sometimes amusing, confusing and entertaining. Having taken a literature class in HS where we read specific stories/chapters and books and then discussed them opened my eyes into a world of understanding that what I read and my classmates read even though were the exact same words, what we personally got out of those words could be a huge difference. So I have always assumed art and the world around us is the same, we all see something, read something but the internals in us cause us to appreciate or dislike it for specific reasons. So, I will agree Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but not having a definition of art, doesn't allow me make a decision at this time. So maybe the first question would be for a specific definition of art?

Edited to add GOOGLE'S definition:

1.
the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination, typically in a visual form such as painting or sculpture, producing works to be appreciated primarily for their beauty or emotional power.

2.
the various branches of creative activity, such as painting, music, literature, and dance.
 
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i remember something that bill alexander once said, at the beginning of one of his paintings. if memory serves, it was some sort of sunset. but, when he started, he was talking about what is art, and put a spot of red on the white canvas, and asked, is this a sunrise, or a sunset? is it a thunderstorm? then he went on to complete the painting. for me, art is something that you can appreciate it within 3 seconds of seeing it, and not wondering, what the heck is it? then there was pete conrad, when asked during medical testing, by a psychiatrist, after being given a blank sheet of paper, what he saw in it. he looked this way, and that, and finally told the doc that it was upside down. it was only after the doc leaned over to look at the paper, that he realized that he had been had.
 
This is discussed a lot on other forums... And I have never noticed that a consensus is made... for instance, the scroll saw work that I do in my opinion is not art... It takes patience and determination, but a I am just cutting from a pattern.. I am not even doing the hardest part of the project which is making the pattern. To call it art, would be like calling a paint by numbers picture art.. However there is a scroll saw "artist" out there. She lives in the UK, and her name is Fiona Kingdon. She does scroll saw work freehand, no pattern.. and it is all pretty very amazing.. She has made a few patterns from her work, which I have done. Her pattern are not identical to her workpiece because it is made after the orginial piece is complete... She is a artist, I am a hobby cutter....

www.fionakingdon.com

Available Art Work — Fiona Kingdon -Fine Art in Wood

www.fionakingdon.com www.fionakingdon.com
 
Sooo - What is AN ARTIST.

An artist in my definition is one that thoughtfully executes an idea in order to achieve a desired result, feeling, thought, expression or paint a picture - in another persons mind.
An artist can be a beginner, expert, skilled, student, apprentice or master.
Art can be expressed via; word, colors, textures, stone, wood, sound, touch or whatever medium the artist decides to use with any tools they desire.
An artist uses any form or strategy to attain the desired result, whether abstract or conventional.

The end result of the artist in to illicit the WOW effect.
WOW - look at what the artist created - wow - that is fantastic.
look at the detail - look at the form - look at - of wow read this etc etc etc.
Love what they have done with that song - story - instrument.

BTW - Rennies daughter does an EXCELLENT talk on art,
 
Every form of art has positive and negative space, I was tought that the use of those spaces is the challenge to create art that is esthetically and emotionally pleasing. In painting I was tought every inch of a painting or drawing, should be a painting or drawing within itself.
Reason my work gets so detailed to the extremes.
(Unlike today's standards, art is a learned appreciation of a talent or talents a person possess.) This is the debate
 
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Dave you are an exceptional artist

We've seen tonis work another incredible artist

my audience is easier to pleaee
Every day I get my large coffee Kaden points to one of his cartoon characters and I draw it on the cup
To him it's beautiful artwork
Today he picked elmo
 

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Toni Ciuraneta said:
As I said this is a promising thread, only by debating we will be able to agree in certain points.

I would like to start discarding a common misconception. Whatever piece we observe cannot or should not be considered “art” only because of the difficulty in its making. If that was so, any piece made in a dark room, hanging down and wearing boxing gloves would be ”art” and I believe that the admiration that that exploit would create would not be considered art, would it?
To me art, is subjective by definition, that’s why it is so difficult to agree on what can be considered art or not. If it was objective, we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

So we can continue from here if anyone wishes, the debate is open.:unsure::huh:
Click to expand...


lemme start again....to me, a high level of intricate work, a degree of difficulty shown in a piece, well, to me thats art.
cost does not make it art.
if someone carved something out of 18 karat gold, Im sure it will be super expensive, but it might just be a lump of gold.
if someone carved an exact image of my grandson on a 3 dollar piece of rock, an image so lifelike, Id consider that fine art.
 
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